Do you think Visa will eventually stop recurring?

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

American Express ended its role long time ago in recurring transaction in the adult business online...do you think Visa will also one day? Yes, its a scary thought for many of us who operate our business in recurring memberships, but we should discuss and think about this...With all the chargebacks, support, problems, etc. in recurring that Visa faces, do you think they will ever end it? They probably have made enough money already...

[Cleo]

I think our sun will explode one day.

[Thumbler]

Cleo, do you think that will be before or after the sky falls?

[DangerDave]

http://eleaston.com/ra/cl20.ra

|brick

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

Just look at these replies when trying to make a decent discussion? wow....

[Agent]

I thought that sig looked a little big.

[Greenguy]

1 - No one will ever say that they have made enough money - not even Bill Gates.

2 - What should we, the average everyday webmasters, be doing about this?

3 - What do you know that caused you to start this thread?

Any news on Acacia? 2257? FCC cracking down again? Prosecution of spammers?

Like Jim always says, I'll worry about these things when legal documents come across my desk :)

[Agent]

Just look at these replies when trying to make a decent discussion? wow....
They have identified this thread as scare-mongering. Ever watch FoxNews? Read Drudgereport? They do the same thing. It's called infotainment. They create issues where issues don't exist to sell advertising time and sig space.

[SinSational]

visa would be foolish to stop recurring

[tickler]

Hopefully Visa/MC will either be forced out of this business due to technology advances, or they will quit being such shit asses and do their jobs properly.

Like, how much longer will people really need "credit" cards to spend their money on the internet.

PornCards are already here. Saw a news article about variety stores selling them to underage kids in New York a couple of weeks ago.

Personal ID chips that are implanted just under the skin. They are already in use.

Bio-ID from fingerprints, retinal scans, face-reconition systems are also widely used in highend secutity systems.

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

1 - No one will ever say that they have made enough money - not even Bill Gates.

Well when it costs more to maintain or causes to many problems with the entire vision of an organization, sometimes for the integrity of the company, they may...

2 - What should we, the average everyday webmasters, be doing about this?

Well, for the average webmaster probably not know what to do to secure their future...thats why i think many average webmasters or i shall rather say, small programs will go out of business, bought out or disolve which has been happening already. The bigger programs will have a long term plan and thats a whole conversation itself...maybe over a drink :-)

3 - What do you know that caused you to start this thread?

I started this thread to see peoples opinion NOT cause i know something or even if i did, would still want to start a discussion about a valid point.

Any news on Acacia? 2257? FCC cracking down again? Prosecution of spammers?

I am sure there is but not in this thread...

Like Jim always says, I'll worry about these things when legal documents come across my desk :)

Well, i value and respect your way of thinking but thats not how i look at things, i do evaluate, think and plan for the future ahead of time...

[ClickBuster]

Well, most probably membership will rise it's cost and probably many webmasters won't make it in the beggining and quit, a lot of space will be cleaned and the business will get more civilized. People will fight more and more with cheaters, spam, etc to make sure they're getting most of their work. The free content will decrease it's amounts as it would be more important to generate MORE sales than ANY sales (it's always important, but pretty hard with all that free porn on the net). 90% of content provided will be DRM protected movies, in order to make sure is protected as much as possible. A lot of TGPs and CJs will bankrupt, as their main income is based on Per Signup trial/free programs, which will most probably dissapear, as RevShare/Partnership would be the only meaningful option for the paysite/sponsor owners, mentioning the processing fees, legal taxes and shitload of other stuff. Although, no-recurring will turn this industrie upside-down and btw - I see it as the worst thing that can happen to it.

-- Andrew

PS
Raffi, great thread :)

#Edit: touched my txt a little bit :)

[Head Boy]

I think Visa will be an also ran on the Net in 5 years. They are a pain in the bum and rely on a bit of plastic (even if it's called a virtual Visa). They also advertise their support of buyer fraud, and that can't be giving sellers a warm glow. SMS billing and email transfers have got a bigger future. Banks also seem to be making a few cautious steps into online transfers. PayPal offering credit for some purchases shows another level of maturity for net friendly payments.

[Greenguy]

Well when it costs more to maintain or causes to many problems with the entire vision of an organization, sometimes for the integrity of the company, they may...Visa is loosing money on this? Do you have any documentation to back this statement, because I'm sure a lot of us would love to see it.

Well, for the average webmaster probably not know what to do to secure their future...thats why i think many average webmasters or i shall rather say, small programs will go out of business, bought out or disolve which has been happening already. The bigger programs will have a long term plan and thats a whole conversation itself...maybe over a drink :-)You have to remember that 95% of the people that post here do not own or run a program - we just build sites & galleries & whatnot & promote other programs. And smaller programs go out of business every day, mostly because they don't know what they're doing - this is not new news.

You want to know why I think Visa will be here for a long time? One word: ePassporte.

Why would Visa sink all that money into what is basically an adult version of PayPal if they saw problems 2, 5, 10 yeas down the road?

The sky is not falling, Chicken Little :D

[Jim]

I do try to stay away from the fear monger type threads.

[Useless]

I only take cash. Credit is for pussies.

[Cleo]

It could always be like back when I was in the adult contact magazine biz and groups of hookers would come to my front door each month to renew their ads in my magazine for the following month.

Back on topic to doom and gloom…
Every doctor that I've been to lately keeps on telling me that I have less then 100 years to live. Rather then getting really disturbed about this, I'm already a disturbed enough person thank you childhood, I just live for present and do the best I can each day and not allow distractions like the sky is falling to hinder me in my daily strive to succeed.

[Ramster]

Will Visa ever pull out? Who knows. I don't think so. And if they do then adult will go the way of casinos. I don't think you can use your visa at casinos online so they make it so you can deposit money into epassporte or some other form then spend your money.

[koolkat]

Personally I don't like recurring. I think if you have a product worthy of keeping them coming back, then you don't have to worry because they will renew on their own!

[urb]

Funny, I saw a thread just like this one on Oprano.
http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?showtopic=17281

[ClickBuster]

Personally I don't like recurring. I think if you have a product worthy of keeping them coming back, then you don't have to worry because they will renew on their own!
I assume, you're working with PerSignup programs only? :) No recurring and they will "poof" dissappear :) It will be 1 time payment anyway, so why pay you more, when you can get only half of it? Don't hate recurring - love it!

-- Andrew

[Cleo]

I make more money off of recurring each month then I do off of pay per join.

Recurring rocks since your bass of incomes grows each month.

The trick is to find programs that actually recur.

[ClickBuster]

Actually many sponsors out there have good recurring sites, the problem is how to get in the line :) The big webmasters have already occupied many available positions, so the question is where to get that virgin traffic we all need ;) When a promising sponsor cames up it get quickly saturated by the *playas*... and old BIG sponsor were saturated long long time ago... However, if you have the proper content, traffic and tour - you can sell the site and just live from the rebills. However, there're some exclusive cases :) for instance - reality sites... bigsausagepizza - how da fuck am I supposed to make a free site from it, when the content gets quickly overused and there just ain't more of it??? I should start shooting my own series? Fuck no!

-- Andrew

[cd34]

I would expect Visa would remove the grace period before they disallow recurring. Although, they could easily strike level 3 accounts from recurring, but, I think there is farrrrrrrr too much profit there for them to turn their back on adult. Aside from the fact that Visa says they are fighting fraud, they make money off those penalties. And, small transactions tend to go through more easily than large purchases, keeping a credit card user's balance closer to the max. That of course generates more interest.

Amex just did change the grace period on their Optima and bank-branded Amex cards. Turn in your American Express card for a NEW MBNA American Express card that charges you interest from the date of purchase, all while we decide to charge you $75/year for the privilege. Thank you, but no.

[Thumbler]

However, there're some exclusive cases :) for instance - reality sites... bigsausagepizza - how da fuck am I supposed to make a free site from it, when the content gets quickly overused and there just ain't more of it??? I should start shooting my own series? Fuck no!

Maybe you could start speaking nicely to your pizza delivery guy and see if he'd be interested in earning some extra tips :D

[Greenguy]

Funny, I saw a thread just like this one on Oprano.
http://www.oprano.com/msgboard/index.php?showtopic=17281Oh great! Now people are posting ideas & threads from other board as if they were their own. Wonderful |banghead|

[basschick]

if visa stops recurring, we'll advertise our sites on the join page like this:

"No more worries about seeing charges on your credit card bill month after month - our site only charges you for the month you join. No recurring billing here!"

and guys who were nervous about rebills will join. it all balances out in the end.

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

I think Visa will be an also ran on the Net in 5 years. They are a pain in the bum and rely on a bit of plastic (even if it's called a virtual Visa). They also advertise their support of buyer fraud, and that can't be giving sellers a warm glow. SMS billing and email transfers have got a bigger future. Banks also seem to be making a few cautious steps into online transfers. PayPal offering credit for some purchases shows another level of maturity for net friendly payments.

I have to agree somewhat...third party private label processors are getting more popular and i do see a future for them...

[Useless]

I thought you were leaving. |yawn|

[basschick]

hey, raffi - what are you doing up so early?

[RawAlex]

Raffi, you look so good recycling threads from another board... slow news day?

Alex

[Cleo]

He did go over there and start a hello thread today. I guess he figured that if he was going to steal thread ideas he should become a member.

[RawAlex]

Yeah, I am not sure what is worse: making up scare threads to increase page hits, or copying that thread to another board.

Alex

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

Oh great! Now people are posting ideas & threads from other board as if they were their own. Wonderful |banghead|


Relax Greenguy...dont jump to conclusions...i am not a member of that other board and never heard of it....so dont assume and start false accusations....this topic i started was because of a phone conversation i had with another heavy player in this industry...

[MrMaryLou]

Raffi what happen to your happy face avitar?

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

He did go over there and start a hello thread today. I guess he figured that if he was going to steal thread ideas he should become a member.

I went to that board when " URB " mentioned about it first on this thread and decided to join since people there seem to focus more about discussing important topics ( which happened to be a coincendence me posting here ) instead of you people replying more on threads on how to bash people rather than discussing about the topic....grow up man....wow....i decided to post a valuable topic thread and still get this shit from everyone?

[urb]

Raffi, seriously, you'd never heard of Oprano before?

[Agent]

if visa stops recurring, we'll advertise our sites on the join page like this:

"No more worries about seeing charges on your credit card bill month after month - our site only charges you for the month you join. No recurring billing here!"

and guys who were nervous about rebills will join. it all balances out in the end.
The $35 flat payouts from sponsors would surely end. They would have to move to a revshare model. I like revshare. A lot of people don't, so they'd drop them as sponsors. I see few people taking the time to send out a new cheque every month to renew access to adult sites but I could be wrong.

Signing up is an impulse thing. The wife is out shopping. The buyer is sitting in his work den alone. The credit card is in his back pocket. He's feeling a bit randy. By the time the sponsor gets the cheque and enables access to the site(s) the buyer has already satisfied himself with the lingerie section of the Sears catalog and may have lost interest.

[Useless]

Relax Greenguy...dont jump to conclusions...i am not a member of that other board and never heard of it....so dont assume and start false accusations....this topic i started was because of a phone conversation i had with another heavy player in this industry...
So you're a 'heavy player' who has never heard of that board? The only thing heavy is the layer of grizzle on your spam.

[MrMaryLou]

Heavy Player mmm a new term?

[Useless]

Heavy Player mmm a new term?
It's a morph. A cross between heavy hitter and major player. Sounds better than major hitter.

[MrMaryLou]

Ah a Megalomaniac LOL

[Thumbler]

Heavy Player mmm a new term?
In the football season we call them linebackers :D

[Mizz B]

I do try to stay away from the fear monger type threads.

I'm with you!

Isn't there enough to worry about these days without making up scary 'what if' situations. :(

[AdultLoungeRaffi]

Raffi, seriously, you'd never heard of Oprano before?

I swear i have never heard of Oprano until it was mentioned in this thread...i have never even posted on boards before...i have always been behind the scenes...my staff may have but not me...until now...usually owners of programs never post on boards...its either the marketing directors, affiliate support staff or president, etc...but not the actually owners...how many owners of affiliate programs do you know who post here? not many...

[DangerDave]

i have never even posted on boards before...
http://www.greenguysboard.com/board/showthread.php?p=70084#post70084 - Posted Jun2004
http://bbs.mediumpimpin.com/showpost.php?p=123026&postcount=1 - Posted Mar 2004