Did Hell freeze over and I didn't notice
 

Murdoch to host fundraiser for Hillary Clinton

The decision underlines an incongruous thawing of relations between Mr Murdoch and Mrs Clinton, who in 1998 coined the phrase “vast rightwing conspiracy” to denounce critics of her husband, such as Fox News, the conservative cable channel owned by Mr Murdoch’s News Corporation.

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/61faabde-de...0779e2340.html

Wow nice one!

I doubt anyone would call Murdock a fool. He has his agenda too :D

I am thinking that too. He probably thinks like me, that this country, right or wrong is not ready for a Woman President. So, you get her enough money to run and she gets the nomination. Believing that she can't win against any old white guy, Murdock wins.

I mean if you look at who votes, the majority are either older men or Women that still thinks that their place is in the home.

Murdoch has a very good skill at picking potential future winners and getting on the right side early, which in theory means he would be higher up the friends list for th benefits of supporting the president.

I also think that, as a media type, Murdoch is smart enough to see that the current administration and it's ultra conservative base are NOT serving his best interests, and that if Hillary runs, the republicans likely have nobody on deck to challenge solidly.

Seriously, polls show Hillary would do well, and the republicans right now have nobody even coming out of the noise. The normal routine at the end of a two term presidency would be to have the VP run, but well, Dick Cheney may be the only man in the US that polls lower than Bush right now, so that ain't going to work.

I think you will see the republican party take a pass at the next presidential election, putting up a token candidate and letting it slip away for 4 years while they regroup.

Democrats are already looking at the potential to take over the house this year... the tide may be turning faster than we could dream.

Alex

I hope you are right Alex. I do believe that it is time for a Woman to be President but, imagine the shitstorm the Republicans will come up with if Clinton wins. They won't just piss and moan about her past but the past of her husband as well.

All of us thought there was no way Bush would win the last election. And, if all the younger people saying "Vote or Die" actually voted, he wouldn't have won.

I just hope we don't see a repeat of that this year. Even more in the next Presidential election. As long as Democrats don't fuck this up, and younger people finally wised up, Democrats should slide right in.

But if the owner of foxnews is really backing a Democrat, he should let his "news" people know :)

I've sad it before and I'll keep saying it until I have a reason not to believe. This 8 year term is a poison pill and the USA is going to hit some very hard times because of deficits in both the budget and trade, the Iraq war, over inflated economy, loss of so many manufacturing jobs and of course the week buck.

None of the people that have caused these long term issues want to be around when the pain starts so they're all going to bail. Cash in now, blame the inevitable down term on the dems and then run the other Bush in 2012 or 2016.

I think that 2010 is going to be terrible times for the average American and that's already been put in place so no one can stop it.

Murdoch also knows that censorship will hurt him as well.

I suggested very vocally one time at a PAC meeting I went to that we start a campain to have people over 75 restricted on their voting privileges. I mean after all you have to be 18 to vote on the one end ..why not put a cap on the other end. I certainly hate that 75 yr olds out of touch with today's reality have a say in things that totally affect my life as a 50+ yr old. and yes i'd gladly give up my right to vote at age 75.

on the murdoch thing..i guess Hillary will be dancing in the arms of O'Reilly at the fundraiser.

maybe the republicans will run Condi and then Hillary would for sure win since the only thing worse in the eyes of a 75 yr old white male would be a black woman in the white house.. other than being the upstairs maid.

|huh |huh

Docholly, Condi has already proven herself to be both very intelligent and completely past her limits in her current position. She has learned mostly from Bush and Cheney to have that "fuck the world" attitude that was very popular in late 2001 and is pretty much worn out and repulsive to most people today.

The Bush administration isn't popular, and it isn't popular mostly as a result of foreign policy, and she is the current public face of that policy... so she is pretty much a dead player for now. But give her 4 years out of office, and she might be a good longshot candidate for 2012.

Alex

Most larger corporations contribute to both parties, hedging their bets for future considerations, and to avoid alienating those who do not share their views

I actually heard a republican say this very thing somewhere. Let the dems get in briefly, then blame it all on them when the shit REALLY hits the fan.

It has been the way it historically works: The republicans are fiscally very irresponsible, with everything from Bush's current world war III, tax reductions for the rich, and ever expanding government apparatus, or back to Reagan's Voodoo economics... in both cases they leave the country with a huge increase in the debt load and a budget that wouldn't balance no matter how many tricks they play. So the country spends like mad, taxes less, and ends up in debt.

8 years later the president is out, the democrats come in, are forced to raise taxes and cut services to balance the budget, and that is all the ammo the republicans need to call them "tax and spend liberals".

When Bush senior got into office, it was a fuckup because he had to raise taxes to make up for Reagan's economic fuckjob, and it killed his Presidency as fast as could be done.

Republicans need the democrats to be President for at least one term so they have someone to blame all their shit on.

Alex

Exactly Alex. But, it's getting bad when they're bold enough to come right out and admit it.

Maybe Bush vs. Clinton|cheers|

Bush Backs Brother Jeb for White House.
http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/05/10/D8HGVTAG1.html

Jeb won't run until we have a balanced budget or at least close to that. There is no easy way to balance the budget, get out of Iraq or make The Department of Homeland Security work so whoever takes over is going to be fucked from the get go.

Jeb 2012 or 2016 and not before.

Democracy is an amusing form of government as it has the potential to allow imbecilles to run the country|huh Those who believe they are spoken to by an imaginary diety would usually be classified as insane, or at the very least dellusional, but within the confines of religion it's a ok|pokefun| |bow|

Unfortunately, the majority has a poor track record for getting it right, as history is replete with the mistakes of the massess being made time and time again. If I had to pick one of the candidates I would choose the most libertarian one of them. 5 trillion rules are great, just keep them to yourself|badidea|

In case some of the hardcore lefties haven't noticed, history is also littered with the reamins of another failed form of government...communism.It does not work...ever.

I despise large government and am just as hard on the current administration so don't take it like I hate all democrats, I just hate large government that spoonfeeds its masses into apathy and sloth, and has so many fucking laws the no one single person even knows a fraction of them. I have an idea, let's take from those who work hard and give it to those who don't do jack shit|headbang| as john stossel says...gimme a break.

Democracy and communism rarely work properly because they are rarely left in their pure form. It is always bent and manipulated to get the desired results.

Commies have to deal with the idea that they have an egaltarian society with some people living in slums and others in chateaus (see Cuba, Russia), and democratic types have to accept that the idea of one man one vote is always tainted by things like "which man" and "how do we count the votes" (electoral college debate, anyone?) Neither system has been allowed to exist in it's totally pure form because it is theoretical and not practical.

Thus you end up with liberal and conservative, socialists and voodoo economists, and every stripe and color inbetween. Most people are honestly not smart enough or not willing to pay the time to really figure what is what - and they are the ones that are manipulated for each election.

Either way, the current western media has, for the most part, turned into mouthpieces and lapdogs for the government of the day. 9/11 has turned the US into a bunch of "agree with the government or you are a terrorist commie no good scum" types. It is really sad.

Alex

well said Alex|thumb

I feel that the internet and it's accompanying freedoms of expression are one of the last bastions of truth, in a sea of frivolity and complacency .The web does not suffer fools gladly, it's chews them up and spits them out.Which is why I support satellite based ISP's:D With absolute freedom, you take the good with the bad.

I have pondered this many times Alex, and have struggled to come up with a form of govt that responds to the individual as a whole instead of a miniscule part of a mindless collective. Although, with the advent of smarter than human AI like what these guys work for http://www.singinst.org/ we may soon see an end to this discussion.

I enjoy being an atheist and a libertine , there are many who do not, I respect their freedom to choose above even my fanatical disdain for their beliefs, however absurd they may be.

The freedom of the individual should not be infringed upon unless it harms another. Just don't tell me I have to dress a certain way, that sex is evil and blowing up heads is ok, or any other blatantly hypocritical meme, cause it just won't fly.

discussing politics is never any fun on this board
everybody has almost the same views

I read an article awhile ago about Dems trying to get friendly with Murdoch

the way i see it, Right now the republicans don't have a viable candidate for president

Gulliani, divorced, a skirt chaser, pro choice, pro gun control

McCain is 70 years old,

Jeb... cmon...his brother is at 30%

ya really have to hand it to Hillary

she shows real leadership skills, she has built relationships with McCain, Newt and now Murdoch

remember a real leader brings people together
this idot we have now just wants to divide people with wedge issues

I think she will have a hard time of it if Gore enters the primaries - there are just too many people in the bible belt that wont vote for a woman (sad but true). On the other hand if Gore comes out swinging, which I believe he will within the next few months, he could win over every consituency except the hard right wingers.

Linkster

I dont think so
I think shes gonna clean house with women voters

this is really historic
the first woman president

I think the rednecks will tell their wives to vote for who ever the relegous right is backing, but when the women get in to the voting booths and those curtians close, I bet they vote for Hillary

Tommy - listening to these women down here - at least the tiny amount that actually vote (which is probably only about 5% of the community) they all think a man would do a better job and think that Hillary is just an extension of Bill - and dont respect her one bit

You just need to look at who actually votes.
http://www.census.gov/population/soc...004/tab04b.xls
The largest being between 45 and 64
The lowest being over the age of 75 and the next to lowest, 18-24
As I said, men between 45 and 65 are not ready for a Woman President. And the Women, many still believe their place is in the home and not the White House.

If more 18-24 year olds were to stop protesting everything and do the important thing (vote) a Woman might have a chance. But, with only about 11% of these kids voting, an uptight old white man will be in the White House this next election.

If a Woman runs on the Democratic Ticket, the only chance she will win is if the Republicans put up a Woman as well.

As for Hillary herself, I would vote for her. I voted for her for the Senate. But, if she ran for President, the Republican Hate Machine would talk and talk about her past problems and failures. And as I said, she would not only have her own problems but her husbands as well.

Republicans are great at spinning anything the Democrats say or do. Jesus Christ, they got her husband impeached for lying about getting a blow job. I can see it now..."She showed weakness by staying with a husband that admitted to cheating on her, how could she be trusted to be strong when we need her?"

It's a horrible fact that the US is not ready for a Woman President. Maybe, just maybe, we are ready for a Woman Vice President. But even that is risky.

I have to repectfully disagree..

since 'we' burned our bras in the late 60's and early 70's .. those of us who went through the glass ceiling are now 50-65.. I mean it was a BIG deal when Shirley Chisholm was elected to Congress--the 1st woman-- in 1969.. and a black woman at that from Brooklyn.. which at the time was mainly Italian, Jewish and Caribbean.

so it is very unlikely in that age group that you would find a woman who still thinks her place is in the home. Now those over 65.. well that's a whole 'nother story.

Uninformed woman might vote for Hillary because of her gender but well informed and educated women will vote for the best candidate, gender aside. Geraldine Ferraro didn't get elected because she wasn't the best candidate, not because of her gender.

just my opinion, repectfully.

I really hope I am wrong. We (non-republicans) have a real chance of getting rid of war mongers in the White House. I just hope it doesn't get screwed up by trying to move too fast. Obviously, most voters know it's time for a change. Just not that big of a change.

As for Geraldine Ferraro as the Vice Presidential candidate...When voting for President and Vice President, most people really never care about the Vice President. That year might have been the exception. Of course, Walter Mondale was not a great candidate either. :) Isn't that the real problem with Democrats? They almost never put their best foot forward. Clinton was the exception to that rule. He was smart and knew how to talk to people. Besides him, who have the Democrats put up in recent history? Most of us probably can't even remember.

We've chatted about this before and I really don't believe that the US is open minded enough to have a female leader. I've travelled all over the USA and worked with 1,000s of women (I spent 5 years doing customer service consulting and that was 95% women and 4% gay men).

Hilary will get the vote of feminists but a lot of women will not vote for her because they think men should be in charge. I'm talking about women that work in corporate America as most don't want to be in charge and feel that men are better suited.

However, the dems could probably run Jimmy Carter or John Kerry and still win next year because of what you're saying about the republicans. The GOP has screwed things up so bad that I don't think they want to win the next Presidential election. Not if they want to do as the Communists say "What's good for the party".

They'll do a Bob Dole thingy and let McCain run on the condition that he steps down from the Senate. They know he'll loose and then they're done with a Republican that actually practices democracy instead of "Doing what's best for the party".

That is one of my biggest fears. Except, what if the republicans do run McCain and the Democrats run Hillary? McCain is actually liked by most people on both sides. He has the military record and as you say he tries to practice democracy. Just being a Republican will be enough for Republicans. And not being a woman and seeming to be a good, fair man would be enough for a lot of Democrats.

I would actually vote for McCain over Hillary.
I think it is way past due for a woman president, but I still do not think the country will vote for one as of yet.
Even if they were, I definately do not beleive that Ms Clinton is the woman for the job.

That would be OK. McCain seems to believe in democracy while the current administration believes in fascism. McCain may be a republican but he still has the right values to lead a democracy.

With McCain as president and the dems controlling the house the nation will return to the people which is what I want.

The shit is going to hit the fan hard as the % of tax $ used to pay interest closes in on 20% of everything collected. No one can stop that now as Dubya has increased the size of government so much that we can't balance the budget easily. The next President will be publicised as a failure no matter what happens.

Remember Dubya still has nukes and the last 2 months of his office will be more frightening then his dads.

Meatpounder, are you aware of the mcCain/feingold act? It scares the living shit out of me because it infringes directly on the freedom of speech...a VERY dangerous precedent.

I sincerely hope it does not continue in this fashion.

This is exactly what it looks like is going to be the case. IMHO, the only hope is a new horse down the line. This is the first election in a long, long, long, time that didn't have a standing Pres or past VP running so the field is wide open.

I think the US would vote for the right woman. I admire and like Hillary a lot but she is not that woman. Someone along the lines of a Madeline Albright would be stellar (but she wasn't born here).

And what the heck is all this about McCain in every media outlet? He's the same creep the rest of them are. OK, fought in battle, sometimes in opposition to the evil empire, a tobacco chewer (makes him kind of folksy doesn't it? I can't wait to see the spitoon next to the debate lectern). Even if he is Mr. Clean (which he's not), he knows all the other bullshit that's been going on and he has to participate to be a player. Nothing worse in my book than a gangster that pretends he's not (or one that's not and pretends he is). John McCain... NEXT!

However, I would get out the vote for any candidate that had one of two platforms either of which I think would be killer apps.

1. Platform is singularly to undo everything that Bush has done to the best of my ability (obviously Supreme Court is lost, whatever).

2. Platform that promises to do nothing or dedicates itself to eliminating millions of useless, bothersome, intrusive, ridiculous, laws, regulations and committes that have accumulated over the last 40 years. We all clean out our closets sometime don't we? Just leave us alone, send the money back (we'll pay shipping) and let the states handle it (sounds like the OLD republican platform doesn't it).

Lets start debating about what we don't need rather than more of what we do, because what we got isn't cool at all.

Finally, if your candidate is already a millionaire when he runs and you vote for him/her then you get what you got coming. If they're of average means, then at least its pretty easy to figure out when they or their posse has gone bad! Election financing won't let the average joe rise to the top? Probably right... see platform #2.

I remember reading that in the forties and fifties many states had little write-in protest spots for the voter and these were actually tabulated and published as kind of a quirk. These were eliminated because Mickey Mouse was getting an embarrassingly high number of votes. Maybe this should come back just to get a point across.

Funny you mention Madeline Albright. She was on the Colbert Report last night. And she said, when people that could be President in the line of succession were briefed on what to do in the case of Nuclear attack, she was left out. To be President, you have to be born in the US. She was born in Prague and can never be President.

Colbert Report. This guy is great. But I haven't seen his new show, cancelled digital cause I never watch it. Are you hip to this buzz about the Pres Bush roast the other night? A good example of the digital divide. Most of the media only showed that dufus imitation dude mimicking Bush but actually Colbert was the MAIN entertainer and he ripped Bush and the assembled media for all they were worth. "If less government is best government then we're doing great in Iraq"

Apparently he got hardly any laughs because everbody was terrified to do so. The mainstream press barely mentioned him for the same reason. In the websphere, all the blogs were a buzz with how funny he was and courageous and over the last couple of days the Washington Post, NY Times, other biggies user feedback sections were flooded with complaints, accusations, and the like over how the press has just rolled over to Bush. Like 90% of comments were flaming the mainstream press for ignoring him.

Two cultures, two information outlets. Two points of view. the old guard is falling. National newspaper circ. fell again last year 2.5%

http://www.greenguysboard.com/board/...tephen+colbert here ya go DJilla... It was on CSpan, but I think they are done repeating it. There are a few links to it in this thread tho, I believe.

Wow! How did I miss that thread? Shows you how out of it I am. I thought that it was only a few days ago and its been almost two weeks. Thanks! Reading that thread reminded me of the rest of the story which is as you know C-Span broadcast the event but no media showed cuts of Colbert only the double bush. However, the video was all over the net. C-Span went on an immediate cease and desist hunt and threatened everybody. They're selling the DVD for $24.95