search engine domination
 

Google (Live, Yahoo and others) could very easily forge direct relationships with porn producers/distributors and totally eliminate the linklist/tgp/directory model (they may already be preparing to do so).

The advantages to the producing businesses are obvious. Most obviously, Google (or whoever) could guarantee a precisely measured flow of highly convertible traffic to the producer's sites. Measure this against the effectiveness of the hit-or-miss affiliate model.

I suspect that Google (and the other big SEs), merely tolerate the presence of Link-o-rama, DD, Tommy or whoever. When the time is ripe they will drop all porn-promoting sites at a stroke. After a week or two nobody will notice that they've gone.

Discuss.

PS - since linklists/tgps/direcories have a purely commercial objective there's no logical reason for a commercial search engine (Google etc) to give them any credence - let alone prominence.

I am not following your logic. Google does not need to cut out the webmaster, it would be suicidal IMO. I am of the belief that the search engines need us just like we need them.

They could also just buy a popular adult portal and then feed it with lots of traffic or they could run their own adwords ads to adult sponsors... Then they don't kill off all the webmasters and their own company at the same time.

I suspect you are mistaken on this one. :D

You won't find many websites that are purely non-commercial. Even mainstream information based sites are running ads of some sort whether it be affiliate products or contextual ads. The search engines are not against us making money, unless you know something I do not?

I'm not going to pick holes in your comments - though there are plenty.

Nor am I interested in scoring points.

I sincerely believe the writing's on the wall.

In another thread Jay was asking about web 2.

In my opinion - forget it.

Sooner or later a porn-specific SE will emerge (thank all the gods) - and it WILL have some clout. Until then - we're all slaves to Google et al.

People use Google, Yahoo and other search engines because they provide answers to questions. If I'm looking for porn and Google sends me to Link-O-Rama then I'm happy and I keep using Google. If they send me to Vivid and I can't see anything without paying then I stop using Google.

Sure, if Google stopped providing quality answers to questions being asked then they would till have enough traffic to keep going for years and maybe even decades but people would go else where fast and revenue streams would eventually dry up.

i dont think anybody can controle the big ses , yeah for some time till the big ses find out to kick your butt, i know alot of seos and blackhats, the strange is, all thought they had controle the big ses but then they all focus on google, till what, 2 ,3 months ago, again all got hit, also the seo guys, sure they still make huge money but they still got hit, my point, there is no fucking way to controle the ses ( oke unless you are the owner of the bmw site, got banned for cheating and get back in google just like that........... a moneything?:D) just my thinking...aaahhh its nice to be back and just say what you want:D

Pick away, expose the holes. I am open to read your ideas and thoughts behind your logic.

Scoring points with who?

As for the writing on the wall, it has always been there. But not everyone reads it the same way.

What about web 2.0?

There are already porn specific search engines, but IMHO they will never deliver what the mainstream search engines can. Also, I don't view myself as a slave to Google or any other search engine. They are just another tool to get traffic to my site.

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Lowry,

I'm interested in all viewpoints.

I have no attachment to my own views.

I'm entirely open to whatever ideas people might care to express.

Thanks for your comments thus far.

but that whole argument is based on that you think sites like Tommys are dependent on Google for their traffic

and that's not true

you might think that because you see so many people crying on boards about losing their SEO spots
but those are always smaller unestablished webmasters
(I know that sounds a bit dickish)

you never see the bigger tgp owners crying about lost SEO spots

yes there are lots of times in the past 10 years that I have had great S.E. listings but there have been way more times when I haven't had any and I never noticed the difference

I almost never look at stats. the only time I know when I have a good ranking is when somebody tells me


Webmaster: Hey... how did you get that number 2 spot for keyword, wish I had that, how much traffic do you get from that

Tommy: umm......I dont know... then maybe I would say something about alt tags to try and sound like I have a clue

when your looking at sites that have 20 or 30 thousand incoming links, maybe hundreds of thousands of bookmarkers
a site thats trading 150 to 200 thousand hits a day
Google isnt so relevant


This goes back to what I have been saying for years

when I first started I didnt care about premoting sponsors.
I ONLY premoted Tommys, that was my first and only priority
but now all anyone cares about is how many sales they make today

some day soon Tommys is gonna be a search engine anyway :D

i never focused on the fact which linksite or tgp site gave me the best traffic or sales, i always focused which sites just linked me:D low traffic or big traffic, high pr or low, big in ses or low, who cares, i only cared for one thing, getting listed:) i am learning some seo and hell i am getting already tired by the facted what i have to do and watching all the stuff, the oldies, ike gg and tommies and dd , linkster and some more will be always around, even if they would go bad in ses, they have proofen their name in this bizz, all know them, they dont need a ses for that, they will be always wanted, doesnt matter if google fucks up or not, they made name and thats important

One thing is that Yahoo and Google are for the most part fearful of getting involved in adult. Look at googles adsense. Look at what Yahoo does to its Yahoo adult groups. Can you even imagine how much Yahoo could have made from its adult groups in the early part of this decade?!?

Another problem is that once they get in bed with the content producers the surfers will begin to notice this and see it as a shill. People will say "Don't use Google for adult stuff. It is all ads!" now whether this is any better than "It is all Spam!" to them, I am not so sure. But google does not wish to be seen as paid search engine like goto.com was. Sure it has sponsored results, but these are seperate from the normal rankings.

Why would a company go against their own business model? The main objective of search engines is to provide relevant results.

Why stop at porn? There are millions of "hurricane" type sites out there with the sole commercial purpose of producing traffic to promote google adsense. Most of them are now getting filtered out because of duplicate content and a lot of them are just plain irrelavant cookie cutter pieces of garbage.

End users want relevant results for their searches. Remove that from the equation and you are out of business.

Same here - for 14-16 months, I could not find myself in Google & I knew where to look.

I do love the traffic that Google (and all SE's) send my sites, but I have survived without it.

So, since you mentioned my site specifically, I'd fucking love to know what your agenda with all this is.

I'd also love to know why LowryBigwood is considered some sort of ass-kisser since he doesn't agree with you.

You should notice that as well as link-o-rama I mentioned "all porn producing sites" There's no agenda, you've not been singled out, keep applying the patches.

I've no axe to grind with anybody on this issue - lowrybigwood, yourself and tommy included.

:)

I never took any offense

I thought it was a decent topic for discussion

I am even flattered when people use my sites as points in discussion. Good or bad

Greenie, sometimes I think you need a thicker skin :-)

I don't think I need thicker skin, I'm just wondering what eman hopes to gain from this thread.

Why my name is 1 of the 3 named "all porn producing sites".

Why is Lowry being looked at as an ass kisser. (discuss, but not pick holes)

And, like Allfetish asked, why just porn.

So please eman, since you started this, enlighten everyone.

i know what i will saying is not use as any value. but i never take some one serouse when they only focus on google ses, because the ones who do then i have to hear their nagging" google hit me again, i have some traffic issue now" google yes in some way its important, but come one,only focus on google for your traffic???? thats bad, because where will you be when google drops you? and i believe the oldies dont relay on google because if they relay on the traffic from that one they would be no where, never fcus on only one ses..just get your traffic :D


For example: premium sex links, yeah that was a linksite totally focus on google, big mistake i thought that time, they got hit bad that time i believe in 2005, i said my view as a newby on that one even i was already 4 years in bizz why focus on one ses? reason, it was the biggest, well bad mistake, because that same linksite got hit 4 times after that real hard by google, well where do you end then, well with nothing, i dont think its right to focus only on google on yahoo, there are many other ways to get secure traffic with, but ofcourse i was a newbie with that one, but still i knew, so how come others dont know, i think its wrong to focus only on yahoo and google and i never believed that the oldies like gg and tommy and rr only focus on google or yahoo, because if that was the case they wouldnt be found anywhere now, i know a linksite who focus on google and where it ended now, those oldie are smarter and dont need the ses to get their traffic, they dont need those ses:) because they build their porn empire that way already years ago because they made name and got enough other sites to give them the traffic, oh damn i need english lessons, to make my story shorter and easier:D

I think he was just floating an idea he had, a sort of.... what if

and your site is mentioned because your big and popular etc etc

no big deal... trust me you need thicker skin :)

I don't think it's a "What if..."

I think it's an "I'm jealous...." |thumb


...and I know exactly what word set me off: tolerate

I'd also like to know how I'm supposed to be kissing ass? I think you if you check all my posts and comments dating back to my arrival here, I have been anything but an "ass kisser".

Also, I don't understand how eman can say he didn't single anyone out when he used 3 well respected webmasters' sites in the context of being tolerated by search engines for now. As if those webmasters sites suck or something. That's how I took it...

So eman, now you've got my curiousity...

yep, more of an asshole in many cases.|waves|

As for google tolerating Greenie, etc., I personally feel honored that Greenie and the big guys "tolerate" us little guys.
Based on your assumption, why would google bother with listings from any commercial sites...? fuck it, knock out ebay, amazon etc., then, drop any landing pages and give adwords players nowhere to link their ads, thus killing their business model. While they're at it, let's go ahead and knock off anything with adsense on it, after all that's purely commercial.

Any way it goes, your logic is totally twisted. You would be in the targetted group as well as the rest of us in that you are peddling porn or some way operating a business online to earn money. If not, then what are you even bothering to be online for, just to rattle cages and make noise?

I'm waiting for eman to say "April Fool's"|huh

That's just silly. Will they give producers higher visibility links? Maybe, but producers would have to pay out the ass for them (think 60% revshare is bad?), making the affiliate model seem brighter. And even if google decided to do what you claim they will, there would be such a backlash from users. Google has risen to the top by doing EXACTLY the opposite of that. They cater to users every whim, and that means the most exposure to content possible.

There may come a time when Google takes a larger share of clicks from us, but we will never, ever be dropped. Without 5 trillion sites to crawl, they're just another shitty portal. And they know it.

What I should have said, quite simply, is that Google can manipulate the serps as they please while still raking in the adwords revenue. They don't need to provide a free service to porn sites (porn is a special case). There's nothing to stop them from side-lining porn into a separate engine consisting entirely of paid listings (at something like $25 a site it would be a nice little earner). IMHO Google will eventually go down that route, and where Google goes, others will follow (any move towards protecting surfers from unwitting exposure to porn would win them a lot of kudos in high places). They can pretty well do what they like. And they will.

In using the word "tolerate" I intended to convey the meaning "Allow the presence of or allow (an activity) without opposing or prohibiting.". My apologies to those who took it to mean "Put up with something or somebody unpleasant".

And no, I'm not jealous of GG - In fact, I'm much better looking than he is :)

Oooo...even better, they could setup a separate search engine and charge the surfer $25/month for access. :)

To me it seems that Google does need to include adult sites in their free listings because with certain terms, only porn sites are relevent.

But, even if they did start charging, with so many people searching for adult sites, a $25 fee to be included in a separate paid Google search engine would be the best $25 a webmaster would ever pay.

Absolutely. |jackinthe

But, wouldn't that quickly become saturated and then what? How many adult webmasters would quickly be buying up 25 dollar ads for the best terms. Eventually I believe the paid results wouldn't be as relevant as the free results could be, thus losing it's luster.

If everyone paid the same amount, how would they rank the ads? By submission date? How long does your ad get shown?

Just my opinion of course. :D

I'm not so sure Google wants to be in "adult" though.

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