Opinion vs. Fact

[SirMoby]

How many of you are guilty of expressing opinions as if they are facts when you really have no clue?

How many of you have accepted someone's opinion as fact and later found out differently? Did this affect you in a negative way?

The other night during a chat I mentioned that I have members of Hungarian Honeys that have been recurring for over 2 years. Someone stated as if it were fact that it was not possible and even made additional comments about it. I know they’re very wrong because I have the facts and they don’t but they acted like they knew.

This person seems intelligent and I’ve always valued their opinion but what happens when you find someone is only acting like they know what they’re talking about?

I know I’ve been guilty of this at times but I usually have strong evidence to form my opinions before I express them as facts.

Think about it. Could false opinions be limiting your own beliefs when you accept them as facts?

When you find someone acting like they know a fact when you know they're dead wrong, how do you later feel about that person's opinions?

Again I ask, “How many of you are guilty of expressing opinions as if they are facts”?

[Torn Rose]

Why is this person saying that is not possible? We still have members from 2002, not many but we still have them.

But yeah, too many talk out of their ass.

[spazlabz]

everyone exspresses opinions as facts from time to time. sometimes what we know is true is very difficult to quantify, therefore it could be called opinion.
however, in the case that you mention, that person could not possibly know specific information about your membership base. Saying you are wrong about something so intimate to you would/should reflect poorly on the person making the statement.

Jim

[Dr Bizzaro]

Could the title under my name be wrong?



Nah.....

[Agent]

I've become increasingly paranoid over the past few years about what information I take in and believe. For instance, when I read about tensions in the middle east I often pull my news from CBC, FoxNews/CNN, BBC, AlJazeera and Hareetz - Canadian, American, Arab/Islamic, Israeli/Jewish news sources.

I sometimes report incorrect numbers and names when relaying to a friend something I read or saw on television that I've found interesting. Usually I'll append the phrase "I believe..." before reciting my "facts" so that if I'm caught giving incorrect information I can pull back and admit I was wrong without having to look like a total ass. I know my memory isn't perfect.

I'm very careful posting in the SE forums because people keep their SE theories held close to their hearts and are quick to shoot opposing theories down. Whether their own dogma is correct or not I don't know. I take from the discussions what I think has merit.

There's a particularly interesting thread at this board where this sort of Fact vs. Opinion battle is being played out: http://www.greenguysboard.com/board/...3&page=1&pp=25

Who is in the wrong? Beats me. It's an interesting read though.

[Bill]

I kinda figured that was a case of mistaken identity, maybe a confusion of names, thinking of some other site with a similar name.

Statistically it's not that likely that the comments were about Hungarian Honeys. It struck me as odd too.

These kinds of misunderstandings happen in chats - it's the slowness of the communication, with no facial expressions or tone of voice to help bring clarity and understanding. You probably should have asked what was meant at the time.

[Ramster]

Opinions...facts...it's all perspective.

Seriously I agree. Many times people state something and they are conveying it as fact by the way they say it even though it might be only an opinion. In your case I am not sure why someone would doubt what you say. That seems a bit odd for them to be aggressively denying what you are saying.

Agent Deepshit, where in Nova Scotia are you?

[Surfn]

There are many opinions flying around. Few facts. Even some of the facts are not given out in their proper order to intentionally deceive others.

[Agent]

Originally Posted by Ramster

Agent Deepshit, where in Nova Scotia are you?

Truro at the moment

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by Ramster

That seems a bit odd for them to be aggressively denying what you are saying.

I don't think they knew that I run the site so I didn't feel they were really denying what I was saying. It was more that they were obviously wrong but acted like they knew for fact.

[Jim]

I still get paid by ccbill for members I had back in 99. I closed the site and let ccbill know in 2000.

[Ramster]

Originally Posted by Agent Deepshit

Truro at the moment

Truro? OK.

I grew up in Lower Sackville, moved to Ottawa 7-8 years ago. Coming back in 2-3 years we think.

[Linkster]

Sir M - there are people that make themselves feel more important by spouting their baseless opinions as fact - and to go along with A Deepshit - it seems to happen quite a bit in the SE world as there really are a lot of things that are presented as fact that cant be proven.
In cases where they just dont know the facts (and its usually someone that has just submitted or run a program that is only based on hosted galleries and nothing else) Ive posted before that I have recurs from some sponsors (the aff backend uses their user ID when they rebill) that are still occuring from sales I made in 2000.

Of course I usually mentally note who makes claims based on their opinions and file it away so I know how to handle them in the future - it can be fun toying with them down the road

[Bill]

Just to clarify, the comments involved had nothing to do with SE, they were part of that old debate about PPS vs Recurring.

Someone made what could be interpreted as disparaging remarks about Hungarian Honeys, SirMobys flagship site. These were offhand remarks, I don't think they were intended to be offensive, atho I can easily understand how they could be interpreted that way. But, as I said, they struck me as odd at the time.

I still lean strongly towards believing this was a case of mistaken identity. However, I know very little about H.H., other than recalling when S.M. started it, some years ago. So I'm not competent to judge its retention, or wether or not the commentor had any inside knowledge.

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by Bill

I still lean strongly towards believing this was a case of mistaken identity.

It doesn't really matter if the person knew I was the owner or not. That's not the issue at all.

What was worth noting was a seemingly intelligent person was totally clueless about an issue and commented as if they knew something about the issue. Does it really matter what the issue was?

I've noticed this happens quite often on boards with many issues. What I am hoping to point out to everyone is to not believe everything that you read and also to watch your own written statements.

[Bill]

By mistaken identity I wasn't referring to _your_ identity, but the identity of the H.H. site. I guessed at the time it was being confused with some other site.

What I wondered at that moment was how the commetor could know what was inside your site?

Do you have an affiliate program for that site? Did you give him a pass inside? How could he know what much content HH had?

You'll have to forgive me for not knowing that much about HH. I was under the impression that it was a premium AVS site.

[RawAlex]

Fact versus opinion is often the way the reader takes something. Unless otherwise noted, it should be assumed that all posts on a chatboard as IMHO.

We are all entitled to an opinion. Human nature is to assume your opinion is pretty much the truth unless proven otherwise. Our cultures all have terms like "monday morning quarterback" and "from what I gather" and "exceptions prove the rule" and whatnot that we all use as cover for opinions as facts or near facts.

I think often that posts here are read as fact when they are really opinions and personal experiences.

Alex

[Tommy]

To tell ya the truth, I talk out of my ass once in a while
everybody does sometimes

one thing I have learned in this buisness is everybody lies about traffic and money
and a lot of webmasters have that big dick syndrom

a few years ago I was talking on the phone with a webmaster of a very big and popular tgp and he is just telling me one bs story after another

I can understand that coming from a smaller webmaster but someone as accomplished as he was I found it very disapointing

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by Bill

By mistaken identity I wasn't referring to _your_ identity, but the identity of the H.H. site. I guessed at the time it was being confused with some other site.

What I wondered at that moment was how the commetor could know what was inside your site?

Do you have an affiliate program for that site? Did you give him a pass inside? How could he know what much content HH had?

You'll have to forgive me for not knowing that much about HH. I was under the impression that it was a premium AVS site.

I think we're getting away from the issue. I only used the topic of the false information to make a point.

The point is that many people act like they know what they're talking about when they do not. Some issues to think about on this topic.

How much damage does false information do?

Do you allow it to limit your own beliefs of what can and cannot be done?

Are you guilty of it yourself?

I think we all buy in to bull shit at times and we call sling a bit our selves. The trick is to not allow it to truely influence us and not to harm others by it.

[SirMoby]

Example of my opinion.

I always speak as if Haliburton gets preferential treatment in order to increase thier revenues but in truth I don't know that for a fact. I base my opinion on facts though. The fact that Cheney still has 833,000 stock options of Haliburton and the fact they can't account for almost $2,000,000,000 of tax payer funds makes me believe what I do. My opinion is based is based on some pretty solid facts but it's still me opinion.

[SirMoby]

An example of BS damage.

A new board opened up with some good corporate backing and started off really strong. Then they allowed someone that slings a lot of BS to become a mod. People caught on to the constent flow of BS and the board is now dead. A lot of time and money was lost here.

[SirMoby]

Don't let false information limit your own beliefs. When you read information make sure that you check your sources.

This is probably the most important point. When I started people told me that AVS was dead and shouldn't waste my time. Maybe I didn't make millions but I made $100,000s when peope were telling me it couldn't be done.

If Tommy tells me something about traffic or elevators I'll probably pay attention. If he tells me something about making surf boards I may question the information.

[Mr. Blue]

Opinions, facts, and some cloudy area in between seems to exist on most boards. When I started out a year ago I was listening to advice from anyone posting on boards...it took me about a month to realize just how much bs was posted on some boards.

I discovered that there's a certain group of posters in porn:

1. Ones that offer opinions just to get some board points or nickels - these are the bottom feeders of porn, advice from them should be completely ignored.

2. Ref-opinions - people who say a host, a computer program, etc. is the greatest thing since sliced bread just because they have a ref program. The person may not even use the host, etc, but they'll recommend them to some noobie, because they'll get a quick buck ref fee.

3. Vested interest poster - kinda like the ref poster, only they own said thing that they're spamming. This is usually content providers, hosting companies, and designers. I wouldn't mind the spam so much if they actually posted regularly on other topics. I hate people that come to a forum / community and only think on how they can creatively spam.

4. The people in the know that will give you honest answers and opinions. I'm very happy to say I've been lucky to find a few people that have really helped me out with sound advice.

As for myself, I only state opinions based on personal experience. I always make it known that it's my opinion, my experience, and not a fact and let people make their own mind up.