Are you *SURE* she's 18?

b1ng0 · 2005-02-16, 09:23 PM

Just kind of wondering what you guys' thoughts were when it comes to chicks that look under 18. I'm going to pick on the folks at nubiles.net here because some of their 'talent' looks awfully young... Are we to just blindly assume that if they say they have 2257 docs ( and very likely do ) that the chicks are of legal age? It kind of scares me that if there's some shady shit going on somewhere down the line that is out of my control I could potentially get in a lot of trouble. What do you guys think?

b1ng0

Alphawolf · 2005-02-16, 09:26 PM

If you feel uneasy about using them then don't.

Cleo · 2005-02-16, 09:27 PM

I don't care if the model is 90 years old if the model doesn't look over 18 I don't accept the site.

Greenguy · 2005-02-16, 10:01 PM

Alphawolf hit the nail on the head.

Greenguy · 2005-02-16, 10:13 PM

Let me also add & ask:

Are you sure she/he/they signed a model release?

Are you sure the website operator has a license to use the content?

If they have a 2257 page up & it looks to be in order, then all 3 questions have been answered.

spookyx · 2005-02-16, 10:48 PM

there are a few content providers that visit ggandjim often and are fairly well respected. if you buy your content from a "good" source you are fairly safe.

if you buy your content from some guy living in eastern "Krackastan" I would worry a little

(i just hotlink all of greenguys content because I know he checks his 2257 stuff)

Cleo · 2005-02-16, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spookyx

(i just hotlink all of greenguys content because I know he checks his 2257 stuff)

Really you should just do what I do and steal Tommy's stuff. He has much better content then Greenguy.

|clown|

ArtWilliams · 2005-02-18, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spookyx

there are a few content providers that visit ggandjim often and are fairly well respected. if you buy your content from a "good" source you are fairly safe.

if you buy your content from some guy living in eastern "Krackastan" I would worry a little

(i just hotlink all of greenguys content because I know he checks his 2257 stuff)

Not to be confused with Kancukastan -- home to me and the Great White North! ... Art

b1ng0 · 2005-02-16, 11:48 PM

Quote:

if you buy your content from some guy living in eastern "Krackastan" I would worry a little

LOL, that's part of what scares me, who knows where paysite x gets their content from. All points taken though, and just in case it needs to be said, I was not accusing nubiles.net of anything.

LB · 2005-02-17, 12:26 AM

Quote:

All points taken though, and just in case it needs to be said, I was not accusing nubiles.net of anything.

Yes you are. Your original message implies that the content is questionable.

If the thread was supposed to spark discussion then you should have left the name of the site out.

If it were one of my paysites, you would be getting a letter from my lawyer.

natalie · 2005-02-17, 01:23 AM

I won't list or use content that I believe looks young. Whats worse is when beside those pics are the terms: "Only if you like them young" and "Barely Legal" etc.

Greenguy · 2005-02-17, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by natalie

...Whats worse is when beside those pics are the terms: "Only if you like them young" and "Barely Legal" etc.

Well, those are 2 very different terms - the 1st could be interpreted one way or the other, but "barely legal" technically means that they are legal.

swedguy · 2005-02-17, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1ng0

LOL, that's part of what scares me, who knows where paysite x gets their content from.

If there's horrendous wallpaper and a colorful couch in the set, then you know it comes from eastern Krackastan.

Yell · 2005-02-17, 10:44 AM

I was just talking to GG yesterday about sites with guys or girls content that look very young yesterday and the way they name the sites like "young boy or young girl and young teen" that i don't like so like Cleo said and GG told me. General rule of thumb is that when in doubt, throw it out.

Useless · 2005-02-17, 10:59 AM

You know what Filthy Earl says... Old enough to take my ten dollars, old enough to get banged in the back of a pick-up truck during half time.

tickler · 2005-02-18, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1ng0

LOL, that's part of what scares me, who knows where paysite x gets their content from.

Whether a foreign content provider actually confirms to a yet to be realized 2257 is another question also.

Some european countries consider 17 to be a legal age. And if memory serves, I believe I read somewhere that Ireland has a much younger age limit. |shocking|

I don't even work the "teen" category, so, just observations from a Canuck.

b1ng0 · 2005-02-17, 01:28 AM

Well, I can't edit my post but if a mod wants to, feel free to mask it out with *s or whatever. I didn't mean for it to come accross as though they have underage models. In fact I've seen nothing but positive comments about them and thier program, it was just the first site that came to mind.

Useless · 2005-02-17, 01:46 AM

I have a very narrow definition of what teen is. I see far too many submissions to the teen category or described as teen that, if I were picking the content, I never would have considered teen. Most teen models look too old to me. I hate seeing mid to late 20s babes being described as teen unless they really look like they are 18 or 19. But if they look younger than that, I won't accept them.

As far as Nubile's girls go. I'd bet you could legally take most them out for a few drinks. It's just the way they are being shot that makes them look teen. It's all props, poses, and facial expressions that does the trick. A teen girl carries herself differently than a slightly more experienced girl. If Nubiles can convince you that those babes are teens, then they are doing their job well.

And b1ngo, don't worry about your comment about Nubiles. I seriously doubt that they'd be insulted. If they read this thread they'll probably be pleased to see that their content is good enough to fool a webmaster. That's the secret to any teen sponsor's success. You've got to sell the salesman before he/she can sell the consumer.

BlueQuartz · 2005-02-17, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b1ng0

Well, I can't edit my post but if a mod wants to, feel free to mask it out with *s or whatever. I didn't mean for it to come accross as though they have underage models. In fact I've seen nothing but positive comments about them and thier program, it was just the first site that came to mind.

well dude think twice maybe before you grab someones business name that they have worked hard to create and start dragging it thru the mud.

the idea of the thread is a good one however as underage models is a serious concern and EVERYONE needs to be on the lookout

Head Boy · 2005-02-17, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueQuartz

the idea of the thread is a good one however as underage models is a serious concern and EVERYONE needs to be on the lookout

I agree with that, but penalising and placing excessive burdens on honest webmasters is not the way to go. Forcing a large part of the adult business out of American control will only increase the problem.

BlueQuartz · 2005-02-17, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Head Boy

I agree with that, but penalising and placing excessive burdens on honest webmasters is not the way to go. Forcing a large part of the adult business out of American control will only increase the problem.

define these excessive burdens for us

Head Boy · 2005-02-17, 11:10 AM

2257 is an America only issue, and I think that there are some privacy concerns about full implementation in Europe. If 2257 causes European webmasters to break local laws, then they won't do it, and their declaration may not be complete.

Maybe the best answer is to turn to your own morality, and don't encourage the search for illegal content if you feel that is best.

RawAlex · 2005-02-17, 11:38 AM

Canada has privacy laws as well, and I have run into the a couple of times in the past - companies asking me for information that I cannot legally provide without violating the privacy rights of others involved.

However, 2257 is the standard we all seem to live with. If any part of your business touches the US, you need to be compliant. As a reseller, you have to accept the statements of the program as true, they enter into an agreement with you as a reseller based on their statements. If a site says "all models are compliant with 2257, here is the records location, and you can check them at any time", well, they have made a claim as part of their reseller program. You are operating in good faith.

However, if you go to the site in question and the models look specifically underage (I don't mean 17, but maybe 10 or 12) all the nice claims are nothing. That is to your own good judgement.

I should point out that a number of sites i have seen use very specific wording that does in fact suggest that some of the models are underage. If it looks like KP, if it smells like KP, then leave the room.

Alex

Head Boy · 2005-02-17, 12:40 PM

I haven't read much on 2257 recently, but I thought it only applied to US webmasters. I host with a variety of US hosting companies, and I don't have 2257 notices on many sites. I appreciate that if I wish to submit to US lists that I may have to supply such notices, but that not a legal requirement for me, it's a requirement of the list owner.

I am bound by the laws of England, so there is no question of illegal content on any of my sites. I'd be grateful if anyone with more recent info. could tell me if I've misunderstood the situation.

swedguy · 2005-02-17, 01:03 PM

Head Boy,

If you are hosted in the US, 2257 still apply to you.

2005-02-16, 09:23 PM	#1
b1ng0 I'm going to the backseat of my car with the woman I love, and I won't be back for TEN MINUTES Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 85	*Are you SURE* she's 18?** Just kind of wondering what you guys' thoughts were when it comes to chicks that look under 18. I'm going to pick on the folks at nubiles.net here because some of their 'talent' looks awfully young... Are we to just blindly assume that if they say they have 2257 docs ( and very likely do ) that the chicks are of legal age? It kind of scares me that if there's some shady shit going on somewhere down the line that is out of my control I could potentially get in a lot of trouble. What do you guys think? b1ng0

2005-02-16, 09:26 PM	#2
Alphawolf Don't come to Florida for vacation. We're closed. Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, Florida Posts: 1,874	If you feel uneasy about using them then don't. __________________ Regards, AW Weekly Pay. Sites That Convert. Start Pimpin' Today!

2005-02-16, 09:27 PM	#3
Cleo Subversive filth of the hedonistic decadent West Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Southeast Florida Posts: 27,936	I don't care if the model is 90 years old if the model doesn't look over 18 I don't accept the site. __________________ Free Rides on Uber and Lyft Uber Car: uberTzTerri Lyft Car: TZ896289

2005-02-16, 10:01 PM	#4
Greenguy The Original Greenguy (Est'd 1996) & AVN HOF Member - I Crop Pics For Thumbs In My Sleep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Blasdell, NY (shithole suburb south of Buffalo) Posts: 41,929	Alphawolf hit the nail on the head. __________________ Promote POV Porn Cash By Building & Submitting Galleries to the Porn Luv Network

2005-02-16, 10:13 PM	#5
Greenguy The Original Greenguy (Est'd 1996) & AVN HOF Member - I Crop Pics For Thumbs In My Sleep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Blasdell, NY (shithole suburb south of Buffalo) Posts: 41,929	Let me also add & ask: Are you sure she/he/they signed a model release? Are you sure the website operator has a license to use the content? If they have a 2257 page up & it looks to be in order, then all 3 questions have been answered. __________________ Promote POV Porn Cash By Building & Submitting Galleries to the Porn Luv Network

2005-02-16, 10:48 PM	#6
spookyx Kodak Ghosts Run Amok Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Hobbs End Posts: 1,718	there are a few content providers that visit ggandjim often and are fairly well respected. if you buy your content from a "good" source you are fairly safe. if you buy your content from some guy living in eastern "Krackastan" I would worry a little (i just hotlink all of greenguys content because I know he checks his 2257 stuff)

2005-02-17, 01:23 AM	#11
natalie Whoo! 9/10 the way to buddy plays in "The Christ from Oz"! Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 921	I won't list or use content that I believe looks young. Whats worse is when beside those pics are the terms: "Only if you like them young" and "Barely Legal" etc. __________________ No 2257 woes with Retroraunch Submit to my Punani And my Pink Pussy

2005-02-17, 10:44 AM	#14
Yell You can now put whatever you want in this space :) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Buffalo N.Y Posts: 707	I was just talking to GG yesterday about sites with guys or girls content that look very young yesterday and the way they name the sites like "young boy or young girl and young teen" that i don't like so like Cleo said and GG told me. General rule of thumb is that when in doubt, throw it out.

2005-02-17, 10:59 AM	#15
Useless Certified Nice Person Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Dirty Undies, NY Posts: 11,268	You know what Filthy Earl says... Old enough to take my ten dollars, old enough to get banged in the back of a pick-up truck during half time. __________________ Click here to purchase a bridge I'm selling.

2005-02-17, 01:28 AM	#17
b1ng0 I'm going to the backseat of my car with the woman I love, and I won't be back for TEN MINUTES Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 85	Well, I can't edit my post but if a mod wants to, feel free to mask it out with *s or whatever. I didn't mean for it to come accross as though they have underage models. In fact I've seen nothing but positive comments about them and thier program, it was just the first site that came to mind.

2005-02-17, 01:46 AM	#18
Useless Certified Nice Person Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Dirty Undies, NY Posts: 11,268	I have a very narrow definition of what teen is. I see far too many submissions to the teen category or described as teen that, if I were picking the content, I never would have considered teen. Most teen models look too old to me. I hate seeing mid to late 20s babes being described as teen unless they really look like they are 18 or 19. But if they look younger than that, I won't accept them. As far as Nubile's girls go. I'd bet you could legally take most them out for a few drinks. It's just the way they are being shot that makes them look teen. It's all props, poses, and facial expressions that does the trick. A teen girl carries herself differently than a slightly more experienced girl. If Nubiles can convince you that those babes are teens, then they are doing their job well. And b1ngo, don't worry about your comment about Nubiles. I seriously doubt that they'd be insulted. If they read this thread they'll probably be pleased to see that their content is good enough to fool a webmaster. That's the secret to any teen sponsor's success. You've got to sell the salesman before he/she can sell the consumer. __________________ Click here to purchase a bridge I'm selling.

2005-02-17, 11:10 AM	#22
Head Boy Hello, is this President Clinton? Good! I figured if anyone knew where to get some tang it would be you Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: England Posts: 442	2257 is an America only issue, and I think that there are some privacy concerns about full implementation in Europe. If 2257 causes European webmasters to break local laws, then they won't do it, and their declaration may not be complete. Maybe the best answer is to turn to your own morality, and don't encourage the search for illegal content if you feel that is best.

2005-02-17, 11:38 AM	#23
RawAlex Took the hint. Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 5,597	Canada has privacy laws as well, and I have run into the a couple of times in the past - companies asking me for information that I cannot legally provide without violating the privacy rights of others involved. However, 2257 is the standard we all seem to live with. If any part of your business touches the US, you need to be compliant. As a reseller, you have to accept the statements of the program as true, they enter into an agreement with you as a reseller based on their statements. If a site says "all models are compliant with 2257, here is the records location, and you can check them at any time", well, they have made a claim as part of their reseller program. You are operating in good faith. However, if you go to the site in question and the models look specifically underage (I don't mean 17, but maybe 10 or 12) all the nice claims are nothing. That is to your own good judgement. I should point out that a number of sites i have seen use very specific wording that does in fact suggest that some of the models are underage. If it looks like KP, if it smells like KP, then leave the room. Alex

2005-02-17, 12:40 PM	#24
Head Boy Hello, is this President Clinton? Good! I figured if anyone knew where to get some tang it would be you Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: England Posts: 442	I haven't read much on 2257 recently, but I thought it only applied to US webmasters. I host with a variety of US hosting companies, and I don't have 2257 notices on many sites. I appreciate that if I wish to submit to US lists that I may have to supply such notices, but that not a legal requirement for me, it's a requirement of the list owner. I am bound by the laws of England, so there is no question of illegal content on any of my sites. I'd be grateful if anyone with more recent info. could tell me if I've misunderstood the situation.

2005-02-17, 01:03 PM	#25
swedguy Vagabond Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 2,374	Head Boy, If you are hosted in the US, 2257 still apply to you.