Katrina aftermath - what the fuck???

Linkster · 2005-09-08, 10:49 PM

First off Bill - that article has quite a few false statements in it - I guess the one that stands out is that the state of emergency wasnt declared "as of Saturday" - this is misinformation being promulgated through the Bush press aides - she did declare a state of emergency at 5 pm on Friday - the rest can also be disproven with actual statements that were put out on publicly broadcast tv statements in New Orleans.
This writer BTW is rewriting an article that came out on a blog written by a guy in Florida who made the whole thing up.

As far as the state not wanting aid - that is from what Im seeing not a correct statement either - according to news reports before the storm hit when asked, the governor stated she had not been in contact with the white house

Overall - I am trying to avoid most of the blame stuff because there is so much BS being put out (some even by reknowned journalists that arent checking their stories) and the spin machine is in full force int he white house obviously - since Bush is the one dropping in the polls by a long shot.
As far as local politics - the mayor issued a mandatory evacuation on Sunday morning - whether any large city could really evacuate all of its people in 24 hours is debatable - I tend to think its impossible - and anyone that thinks that it really could have been done any better with that timeframe should be in that position instead - but even if you had 1000 busses waiting, airplanes ready, troop transports standing by in the roads of New Orleans, the same people that didnt leave before still wouldnt have left - they DIDNT WANT TO! and still dont!

As far as your statement about FEMA and their response - that is a normal response from FEMA under the homeland security umbrella - that is why every former director of FEMA has said that the setup now is stupid - secondly - a lot of people are hammering the director for ineptness - which may be true - but its not his job to do immediate response - that responsibility is with the 6th district of FEMA located in Texas - and they did respond per their plan - as did numerous other governmental agencies (ie FBI, ATF etc who were in the city as soon as the storm was over) - but they were doing what they are supposed to do per their plans - which is to protect government interests in the city ONLY! That is the fault associated with the new Homeland security department - it places all of the initial "disaster recovery" on local fire depts, police and sheriff depts - the amount of money they were given to prepare for response was incredible - of course most departments just bought new command busses, coffee dispensers etc. FEMA also provided locals with money to train for these type of disasters, as FEMA was transferring the "job"

I hope you understand that I dont like what I see - but being my age and having been through riots, bombings and other amazing things I saw as a teen (like seeing Washington DC on fire) - and watching the transfer of power under the homeland security department and knowing what would happen with an additional layer of red tape - I fully expected this to happen - just didnt think it would happen so close to home

Linkster · 2005-09-08, 10:54 PM

BTW Bill - having been to so many Mardi Gras events - in the back of my mind I still have spinning this feeling of something just not being kosher - this police dept and the local sheriffs, hwy patrol etc, every year, can control 1.5 million drunks partying, killing each other raping, looting, you name it - and do one fantastic job of it with never a complaint or issue - and yet a little storm that blows some water into the city comes along and they go ballistic? Something smells

Linkster · 2005-09-08, 10:58 PM

OK - one more little post LOL
Here is what Region 6 of FEMA did on AUG 30 - which is exactly by the book and exactly the way FEMA is set up now:
http://www.fema.gov/news/regionnews.fema?region=6

CaptainJSparrow · 2005-09-08, 11:56 PM

Hey Bill, that local TV station's website is at:

http://wafb.com/

You know, I'm not much into politics as I stated earlier. My guess is that the governor is incompetant and that she didn't want to give up power to the federal government because she thought that she'd never win another election if she did. Unfortunately for her, she probably won't anyway.

Having 1 central authority that controls all of the forces that you mentioned earlier is probably a good idea. Too many chiefs usually means that there is alot of arguing and not enough results. That said the federal government is such a behemoth that it would be amazing if they truly accomplished anything any faster than what is currently being accomplished.

I still say that our contra-flow worked exceptionally well and that the majority of people that wanted to get out, got out.

We'll know more about the shootings and looting over the next week or so. I will keep ya'll informed when I hear things that are confirmed...such as when my friends in the reserves or police departments tell me things that they've seen first hand.

Good night all.

furrygirl · 2005-09-09, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linkster

BTW Bill - having been to so many Mardi Gras events - in the back of my mind I still have spinning this feeling of something just not being kosher - this police dept and the local sheriffs, hwy patrol etc, every year, can control 1.5 million drunks partying, killing each other raping, looting, you name it - and do one fantastic job of it with never a complaint or issue - and yet a little storm that blows some water into the city comes along and they go ballistic? Something smells

Wait, are you saying that you are skeptical of reports of police misbehavior because they never had many problems you could see during Mardi Gras?

The big difference between the two being that one is a bunch of better-off partiers, one is a bunch of poor, starving, sick people who were left to die. I'm not saying that shooting at rescuers helps anyone, but I do completely understand where people are coming from with the anger and frustration.

Plus, are there any real, confirmed reports of this mass raping and cop-shooting I keep hearing rumors of?

And, on another note, I'm still looking to find someone down there accepting volunteers. And new leads from anyone? I'm thinking of just flying down there with a backback full of Clif Bars and bug spray and seeing what I can do.

Linkster · 2005-09-09, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furrygirl

Wait, are you saying that you are skeptical of reports of police misbehavior because they never had many problems you could see during Mardi Gras?

The big difference between the two being that one is a bunch of better-off partiers, one is a bunch of poor, starving, sick people who were left to die. I'm not saying that shooting at rescuers helps anyone, but I do completely understand where people are coming from with the anger and frustration.

Plus, are there any real, confirmed reports of this mass raping and cop-shooting I keep hearing rumors of?

I dont think I was trying to say I was skeptical about the police mis-behaviour, more I think I am concerned with the second part - that so far there hasnt been one confirmed report of the shootings and rapes - other than a few heresay reports that the media keeps blowing up - and unfortunately seems to dominate the news instead of reporters doing their job and getting facts (something that they seem to have forgotton over the years)

I tend to believe that there is still a group of old gang members that have run several neighborhoods for some time, that are still there trying to salvage their turf - and may be taking potshots at cops. It just amazes me though that the media has twisted so many stories - the one I keep thinking about is the "police turn into looters and ransack Walmart" story. Here is a whole precinct of cops that have lost their headquarters, have no communication with the chief of police, see looters robbing walmart, shoo them away, and set up their HQ in Walmart - the news media reports it as police looting - but when you talk to the captain of that precinct he is pretty adamant that he was just trying to find a dry place to he could group his cops into one place and set up a central dry location. Just one example of the news media taking a story from an evacuee and turning it into fact - fortunately one news group actually went out to the Walmart and interviewed the captain of police and he basically told the reporter to F*** off when asked about his cops being looters.

Kinky · 2005-09-09, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Linkster

It just amazes me though that the media has twisted so many stories - the one I keep thinking about is the "police turn into looters and ransack Walmart" story. Here is a whole precinct of cops that have lost their headquarters, have no communication with the chief of police, see looters robbing walmart, shoo them away, and set up their HQ in Walmart - the news media reports it as police looting - but when you talk to the captain of that precinct he is pretty adamant that he was just trying to find a dry place to he could group his cops into one place and set up a central dry location. Just one example of the news media taking a story from an evacuee and turning it into fact - fortunately one news group actually went out to the Walmart and interviewed the captain of police and he basically told the reporter to F*** off when asked about his cops being looters.

some police were looting

HERE IS THE VIDEO

Lemmy · 2005-09-09, 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kinky

some police were looting

HERE IS THE VIDEO

That's hilarious...and disturbing.

docholly · 2005-09-09, 09:43 AM

With all due respect Linkster, one thing i do have to take exception to is this:

Quote:

No one down there was "left to die"

I think at least 30 people would take exception to that:

At least 30 found in Nursing Home

..quite frankly who is to blame or what kind of shoes Condi was buying, or what bunker was Cheney hiding in, or what was done is trivial at this time.. those who think GWB did a GREAT job will continue to think so and try to 'blame' everyone else.. and those of us who think he's destroying 200+ years of democracy will just use this to bolster our position.

Let's just hope for the next 6-9 months we have no other disasters anywhere else in the country that require immediate action because it might take over 2-3 weeks just to find the National Guard.

Surfn · 2005-09-09, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kinky

some police were looting

HERE IS THE VIDEO

That is disturbing on so many levels

Linkster · 2005-09-09, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furrygirl

one is a bunch of poor, starving, sick people who were left to die. I'm not saying that shooting at rescuers helps anyone, but I do completely understand where people are coming from with the anger and frustration..

No one down there was "left to die" - the days before the storm came in the police were driving through every neighborhood with loudspeakers telling people to get out and where they could get busses - and to use the superdome as a last resort shelter. Having lived (temporarily) in one of the poorest neighborhoods down there I can tell you that everyone has a TV and would have seen the mayor and governor two days before the storm telling them to get out, and the only anger they have is when the cops try to help them - Im not totally heartless - I just know that 99% of the people that wouldnt leave are the ones that are still there refusing to leave and hiding out in the projects.

As far as wanting to help out I know the Red Cross is still taking volunteers - they train you for an hour and then put you out there helping people - although I dont think flying in would be a viable option yet

2005-09-08, 10:49 PM	#1
Linkster NO! Im not a female - but being a dragon, I do eat them. Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sex Delta Posts: 5,084	First off Bill - that article has quite a few false statements in it - I guess the one that stands out is that the state of emergency wasnt declared "as of Saturday" - this is misinformation being promulgated through the Bush press aides - she did declare a state of emergency at 5 pm on Friday - the rest can also be disproven with actual statements that were put out on publicly broadcast tv statements in New Orleans. This writer BTW is rewriting an article that came out on a blog written by a guy in Florida who made the whole thing up. As far as the state not wanting aid - that is from what Im seeing not a correct statement either - according to news reports before the storm hit when asked, the governor stated she had not been in contact with the white house Overall - I am trying to avoid most of the blame stuff because there is so much BS being put out (some even by reknowned journalists that arent checking their stories) and the spin machine is in full force int he white house obviously - since Bush is the one dropping in the polls by a long shot. As far as local politics - the mayor issued a mandatory evacuation on Sunday morning - whether any large city could really evacuate all of its people in 24 hours is debatable - I tend to think its impossible - and anyone that thinks that it really could have been done any better with that timeframe should be in that position instead - but even if you had 1000 busses waiting, airplanes ready, troop transports standing by in the roads of New Orleans, the same people that didnt leave before still wouldnt have left - they DIDNT WANT TO! and still dont! As far as your statement about FEMA and their response - that is a normal response from FEMA under the homeland security umbrella - that is why every former director of FEMA has said that the setup now is stupid - secondly - a lot of people are hammering the director for ineptness - which may be true - but its not his job to do immediate response - that responsibility is with the 6th district of FEMA located in Texas - and they did respond per their plan - as did numerous other governmental agencies (ie FBI, ATF etc who were in the city as soon as the storm was over) - but they were doing what they are supposed to do per their plans - which is to protect government interests in the city ONLY! That is the fault associated with the new Homeland security department - it places all of the initial "disaster recovery" on local fire depts, police and sheriff depts - the amount of money they were given to prepare for response was incredible - of course most departments just bought new command busses, coffee dispensers etc. FEMA also provided locals with money to train for these type of disasters, as FEMA was transferring the "job" I hope you understand that I dont like what I see - but being my age and having been through riots, bombings and other amazing things I saw as a teen (like seeing Washington DC on fire) - and watching the transfer of power under the homeland security department and knowing what would happen with an additional layer of red tape - I fully expected this to happen - just didnt think it would happen so close to home __________________ Pussy Chompers Porn Links NSCash

2005-09-08, 10:54 PM	#2
Linkster NO! Im not a female - but being a dragon, I do eat them. Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sex Delta Posts: 5,084	BTW Bill - having been to so many Mardi Gras events - in the back of my mind I still have spinning this feeling of something just not being kosher - this police dept and the local sheriffs, hwy patrol etc, every year, can control 1.5 million drunks partying, killing each other raping, looting, you name it - and do one fantastic job of it with never a complaint or issue - and yet a little storm that blows some water into the city comes along and they go ballistic? Something smells __________________ Pussy Chompers Porn Links NSCash

2005-09-08, 10:58 PM	#3
Linkster NO! Im not a female - but being a dragon, I do eat them. Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sex Delta Posts: 5,084	OK - one more little post LOL Here is what Region 6 of FEMA did on AUG 30 - which is exactly by the book and exactly the way FEMA is set up now: http://www.fema.gov/news/regionnews.fema?region=6 __________________ Pussy Chompers Porn Links NSCash

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2005-09-08, 11:56 PM	#4
CaptainJSparrow You can now put whatever you want in this space :) Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Louisiana Posts: 511	Hey Bill, that local TV station's website is at: http://wafb.com/ You know, I'm not much into politics as I stated earlier. My guess is that the governor is incompetant and that she didn't want to give up power to the federal government because she thought that she'd never win another election if she did. Unfortunately for her, she probably won't anyway. Having 1 central authority that controls all of the forces that you mentioned earlier is probably a good idea. Too many chiefs usually means that there is alot of arguing and not enough results. That said the federal government is such a behemoth that it would be amazing if they truly accomplished anything any faster than what is currently being accomplished. I still say that our contra-flow worked exceptionally well and that the majority of people that wanted to get out, got out. We'll know more about the shootings and looting over the next week or so. I will keep ya'll informed when I hear things that are confirmed...such as when my friends in the reserves or police departments tell me things that they've seen first hand. Good night all.