2257 arguments

[Cleo]

I'm going to go take a shower now. I may even masturbate while I'm in there so it may be a sexual explicate shower. I will not have a 2257 statement shoved up my ass while I'm naked and showering so if anyone from the shrubbery administration wants to arrest me you can find me soaking wet in my shower.

[sue-fl]

Originally Posted by Cleo

I'm going to go take a shower now. I may even masturbate while I'm in there so it may be a sexual explicate shower. I will not have a 2257 statement shoved up my ass while I'm naked and showering so if anyone from the shrubbery administration wants to arrest me you can find me soaking wet in my shower.

Damn Cleo that was the best post!! You sure did start my day off with a great laugh...

[serenity]

Originally Posted by Cleo

I'm going to go take a shower now. I may even masturbate while I'm in there so it may be a sexual explicate shower. I will not have a 2257 statement shoved up my ass while I'm naked and showering so if anyone from the shrubbery administration wants to arrest me you can find me soaking wet in my shower.

I was just buying into the whole panic bit. Doing a little quiet freaking out...Then I read your post, laughed my ass off and feel better about it all. Thanks, Cleo, you are hilarious! Well said.

[Tommy]

Linkster we do argee :-)
I didnt start this thread to stir shit or spread fear

I think there is a need for a new 2257 law and I think webmasters should keep some documents

but the way this law is writtin I am not even allowed to go and vote
they pass this law which stops me from voting and getting rid of them


it would be to simple to upload the documents in to a password protected area on your domain and just simply just put a link to the documents at the bottom of the public page
the doj could just put in the password and see them


a law that would dish out jail terms if you vote or serve on jury has to be changed

I really liked the serve on Jury part
I wonder if the FSC lawers thought od that

[Linkster]

Originally Posted by Tommy

Linkster we do argee :-)
I didnt start this thread to stir shit or spread fear

Tommy - I definitely was not referring to you my friend - you are far from a shit-stirrer (well - most of the time LOL)
I was thinking back to when all of this started and the "Oh my god - jump ship and grab a life-vest posts" made accross most boards including this one by a group of people that had no law background and really hadn't even put any thought into what they were saying at the time. They just seem to come out of the woodwork every time stuff happens around this industry - happened a few years back with COPA twice that I remember and has happened on a few occassions since I think they just get pleasure out of hearing themselves talk with authority and hoping that they get a little following behind them

BTW Tommy - forgot to ask ya when you called - hows that beautiful daughter of yours doing?

[Jim]

Bring it on Cocksuckers
http://www.javes.com

James Barnett
62 West Main Street
Mohawk, New York 13407

[Useless]

Linkster has brought up the most important point, which has been mentioned previously, but isn't really resonating the way it should. They aren't going to go out and just knock on random doors. If anyone ever gets a visit it will be for a damned good reason. Most of us can go on the way we always have, without a single piece of documentation, but those who promote questionable content will always be at risk.

[Wenchy]

Something has been bothering me and it's high time someone said it. The absolute bottom line is that the people the DOJ aimed the new regs at are not, have never been, and will never be the least bit interested in 2257, documentation, or legal content. I keep getting hung up on the idea that this was all done under the umbrella of keeping CP off the Net... but the CPers don't give two shits about laws or they wouldn't do what they do in the first place! Did they honestly think that creating a new set of regulations was going to suddenly scare the CPers into getting legal? Surely even our beloved gov'ment isn't that dense.

If what you say is true, UW, they didn't need this whole bloody shitstorm to accomplish their goals. Last time I knew anything about it, they don't call up the CP assholes who are under investigation and say, "Hi, this is the FBI. We're on our way over to bust you and all your fellow scumbags. Please be certain there is someone home when we knock on the door. Oh, and we'll need access to your computer while we're there so make sure the chair is empty."

Criminals are going to be criminals regardless of what laws/regs are on the books. All they've done is create a huge fucking construction zone on the adult internet commerce highway. Wonder how long it will take them to figure it out?

[docholly]

Since this is SinCity and its a 24/7 town, 9pm-4am are 'normal business hours'. on the remote possiblity that the doj should show up at my 'office' by the time they get to the back where its located they will be very mellow off the ganja contact high and the wicked back beat of the reggae band that plays there.

|rasta|

[Useless]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

If what you say is true, UW, they didn't need this whole bloody shitstorm to accomplish their goals.

You are absolutely correct, Wenchy. This new and unimproved version of the regs was completely unnecessary. I've always thought it to be a completely political move, just to show the right wing constituency that the DOJ is doing something for them. Nothing more. What their intentions are beyond that, your guess is as good as mine. But GW's regime makes a lot of hopelessly scary moves purely for political reasons. 2257 alone does not scare me. It's the big picture that has me in a bit of a panic.

[Mishi]

Originally Posted by Wenchy

Something has been bothering me and it's high time someone said it. The absolute bottom line is that the people the DOJ aimed the new regs at are not, have never been, and will never be the least bit interested in 2257, documentation, or legal content. I keep getting hung up on the idea that this was all done under the umbrella of keeping CP off the Net... but the CPers don't give two shits about laws or they wouldn't do what they do in the first place! Did they honestly think that creating a new set of regulations was going to suddenly scare the CPers into getting legal? Surely even our beloved gov'ment isn't that dense.

If what you say is true, UW, they didn't need this whole bloody shitstorm to accomplish their goals. Last time I knew anything about it, they don't call up the CP assholes who are under investigation and say, "Hi, this is the FBI. We're on our way over to bust you and all your fellow scumbags. Please be certain there is someone home when we knock on the door. Oh, and we'll need access to your computer while we're there so make sure the chair is empty."

Criminals are going to be criminals regardless of what laws/regs are on the books. All they've done is create a huge fucking construction zone on the adult internet commerce highway. Wonder how long it will take them to figure it out?

So right on all counts...and the scary thing is, it may be the 2257 BS that turns this bleeding-heart liberal into an NRA supporter. Suddenly, I get where they're coming from. Yikes!

[lassiter]

Originally Posted by Mishi

So right on all counts...and the scary thing is, it may be the 2257 BS that turns this bleeding-heart liberal into an NRA supporter. Suddenly, I get where they're coming from. Yikes!

Hiya, Mishi!
I'd say it's quite easy to be both progressive and armed. All those Bill of Rights amendments were put in the constitution for a good purpose, and the 2nd amendment was put in not to protect "the rights of hunters" as the often-silly NRA would have it, but to allow the citizens to bear arms as an equalizing force against potential governmental oppression of the people.

[Tommy]

Linkster I know you didnt mean me :-) and my daughter is doing great, walking, talking a little

that gets me thinking ....what about a single parent
cant go enroll your kids in school
cant go to parent teacher meetings
cant even drive your kids to and from school

what about jewish people
they have that holiday where they arent allowed to touch anything electronic
I guess they have to choose between viloating their religon or a federal jail sentance

the republicans Attorney General Alberto R. Gonzales singled us out as a group
when he said he was gonna go after obsenity

and we cant get rid of him because with HIS law he makes it a federal crime for us to vote

[Linkster]

Tommy - you bring up a point that I havent seen posted anywhere - back in May this year the DOJ did something else that no one seems to care about - they formed a new task force called the OBSCENITY PROSECUTION TASK FORCE
and I havent heard word one on any board about any of the things they say they are going after - and I guarantee that they are looking to get into a lot more than this 2257 stuff
Talk about making myself a shit-stirrer LOL

http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2005/May/05_crm_242.htm

[Wenchy]

I noticed that the other day reading through the whining crybaby diatribe that was the DOJ attorneys' "rebuttal" to the FSC filing... I remember thinking it was important at the time, but by the time I finished wading through all the self-serving, totally-avoiding-the-point bullshit, my brain had turned to mush and I completely forgot about it... until you mentioned it, Linkster.

I sure would like to know what's going on in THOSE meetings... or maybe I wouldn't |shocking|

[mrMagoo]

Originally Posted by Linkster

Tommy - you bring up a point that I havent seen posted anywhere - back in May this year the DOJ did something else that no one seems to care about - they formed a new task force called the OBSCENITY PROSECUTION TASK FORCE
and I havent heard word one on any board about any of the things they say they are going after - and I guarantee that they are looking to get into a lot more than this 2257 stuff
Talk about making myself a shit-stirrer LOL

http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/pr/2005/May/05_crm_242.htm

I think (very dangerous) but I'm not sure that the obscenity cases have been held up by the extreme associate case.

I heard the DOJ was going to appeal but haven't heard anything new.

Here is a link to an article:
http://www.peak.org/mailing-list/arc.../msg05988.html

[Dravyk]

I'd thought up a dozen different things wrong with 2257 that should get the sucker overturned ...

But I have to admit, you've come up a beauty, Tommy! And one I'd not seen elsewhere.

Good to see the Old School brains are still working.

[SirMoby]

I'm not supporting the fight against the law to stop record keeping. I do believe that better record keeping could lead to protecting children and I'm for that. This reg is whack and won't help at all. The first that I mentioned to my wife is that if this goes through then I can't take my daughter to school or even the hospital without first notifying the DOJ and vacations will no longer be possible.

Unfortunately the department has stated clearly that it's #1 goal is to fight obscenity. Since the budget for child exploitation and obscenity is linked every dollar spent fighting obscenity is a dollar taken from protecting children.

The next few months will show if our way of life continues or dies.

[RBC]

Some excellent posts here in this thread some funny, some succinct with the state of affairs.

The one thing that has a bug up my ass about 2257 is the major lack of efficient design in interpreting the letter of the law with regard to record keeping. After all, the one thing all the attorney's agree is the ambiguous design of 2257. Going after CP seems to me to be the mantra statement but in truth, don't think so.
More or less it's a witch hunt for whomever the DoJ really wants to go after. The law reads like bad improvised jazz and the DOJ wants to keep it nice and confusing so when the day comes its all about interpretation.

It will surely be interesting to see how this plays out.

[DementedWynter]

You know, you could always write a script that changes that time when you'll be available for inspection. Here's how it works...on Monday, it shows you're available on thursday, friday, saturday for inspection...when you hit Tuesday, you're only available friday, saturday, sunday...etc, so forth and so on.

[Tubey]

Hey all, I just pulled everything down and made copies....some of the content providers do not have a 2257 statement.....some do, but no content....people are saying alot of things regarding this and that... no clear cut this is what you need for a secondary producer this is what you don't.....some are providing content with his or her home address....how can I use that content? Just a bunch of confusion about what is really going on and how it affects us.... personally all my content was purchased but I am pulling everything until some definate answers come out....so I guess I could vote if my site is not active....Right???

[tickler]

Originally Posted by Tubey

....so I guess I could vote if my site is not active....Right???

Well they did say that they wouldn't be prosecuting post facto on model IDs in their filing against the FSC claim.

But, they were told in the comments that a lot of the stuff shows no proper dating. Yet, they still went ahead and wrote it anyways.

ie: I bought content last year that was valid. What happens next month if I use it, and the model IDs are not up to the new standards. Not really interested in tossing content, 'cause they changed the rules in mid-stream. And their 7 year record keeping rules probably prevent me from tossing it.

[Tommy]

Ledfish
I am 100% sure if they tried to prosacute you for not being there
no jury would convict you

your missing my point

are they allowed to pass laws that take away your right to vote and serve on jury
are they allowed to pass laws that make it a federal crime for picking your kids up from school

this whole thing could be done very easly
the doj gives out a user and pass or you regester one with them

you put a 2257 link on the bottom of your webpage that links to a page in a password protected directory
and on that page are the model ids for that shoot

this way they could be checked 24/7 by someone
no need to put investigators on planes, no need for any sort of traveling

1 person from the DOJ could check hundreds of sites a day

[Greenguy]

Tommy - this was the old law:
Any producer required by this part to maintain records shall make such records available to the Attorney General or his delegee for inspection at all reasonable times.
You've been breaking it since you bought your 1st CD of content

[guitar riff]

If they really wanted to stamp out CP then they should just block thr russian federations that would kill 90% of it Plain and simple but no that will never happen they dont want to piss off the russian govt.