Fairly big porn arrests in fla - interesting...

[emmanuelle]

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

An earlier story on it told more. What they did was paid a girl to have group sex at a private party to see if she'd be good for filming in a movie.

Thats the prostitution.. and the rest was more than likely tacked on to see if it will stick.

A little naive there I think. Outside of certain parts of California, shoots are considered prostitiution, as it is sex for money- camera or no camera. Using prostitution to commit further offenses constitutes racketeering, which falls under the RICO act. RICO in turn allows the authorities to seize all assets without due process. Kinda hard to pay your lawyers, let alone affiliates this way.
Furthermore, paying the model's travel expenses violates the MANN act, because they are transporting people across state lines to commit indecent acts (white slavery laws)

The only thing they're missing (at this point) is IRS and a way to tie it into the Patriot Act.

This is a very serious case, with ramifications for everyone in the US who shoots content. I suspect it will set an important precident in the industry. Those boys were doing the same things that dozens of other US companies do all the time. Hopefully this will inspire them to clean up their own acts. Regardless, it hits very close to home, and if any industry related case needs our close attention (and support), I think this one is it.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by emmanuelle

A little naive there I think. Outside of certain parts of California, shoots are considered prostitiution, as it is sex for money- camera or no camera.

Is that some sort of bizzaro world where the 1st Amendment doesn't exist?

[Greenguy]

Originally Posted by Jim

Is that some sort of bizzaro world where the 1st Amendment doesn't exist?

As far as I know, the California law thing is true.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by Greenie

As far as I know, the California law thing is true.

That is strange. It seems like it would have been challenged. Then again, there is a "Non Free Speech Area" around bush and his crony's Just look at all the people that get arrested for wearing anti-bush tee shirts. I guess really nothing is surprising these days.

[Useless]

Originally Posted by emmanuelle

Outside of certain parts of California, shoots are considered prostitiution, as it is sex for money- camera or no camera.

Yes, I believe LA County is the only place in the U.S. where the production of pornography is legal. I think that's what I read.

Do they teach U.S. law in Canada? They certainly don't teach it here.

[emmanuelle]

Originally Posted by Useless Warrior

Do they teach U.S. law in Canada? They certainly don't teach it here.

hehe- We are innundated with US news and culture up here. Most Canadians are more familliar with US laws and politics than their own.

[Chop Smith]

Originally Posted by emmanuelle

...Most Canadians are more familliar with US laws and politics than their own.

For most of us reading the board since April, 03, we have concluded that Canadians think they no more about US laws and politics. Hell, they even have the solutions to all our ills.

equals Chop is joking around. If I offended any of you Northerns go get fucked or smoke a joint and protest something.

Emma, certainly I would not want to offend you as I have a trip planned for you.

[Ramster]

I've been away but have a read a bit. So the site is down 100% now? I guess I better yanks some links? Is that what people are doing?

[Preacher]

Originally Posted by Ramster

...So the site is down 100% now? I guess I better yanks some links? Is that what people are doing?

Yes. I waited a day to see if it they would come back up, but when it wouldn't I had to. On my LL I can just deactivate the sponsor temporarily, but unfortunately on my tgp's my only option is to delete the galleries.

[tickler]

Well here's some more details, with a comparison to an older California case. and a comment by Larry Walters.

It's People Vs. Freeman, Florida Style
http://www.avnonline.com/index.php?P...tent_ID=270764

[lassiter]

Originally Posted by tickler

Well here's some more details, with a comparison to an older California case. and a comment by Larry Walters.

It's People Vs. Freeman, Florida Style
http://www.avnonline.com/index.php?P...tent_ID=270764

I guess I'd simply observe that this is a good reason why most porn videos are shot in California and not Florida. Individual states are gonna take very different views of what constitutes prostitution, and it's very nice that Cali has the Freeman precedent. But a decision of a California court is obviously not binding on any other state. And hasn't anyone noticed that Florida's government is one of the most reactionary bunch of corrupt nutballs anywhere? (And I'm speaking as a Texan when I say that )

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by lassiter

I guess I'd simply observe that this is a good reason why most porn videos are shot in California and not Florida. Individual states are gonna take very different views of what constitutes prostitution, and it's very nice that Cali has the Freeman precedent. But a decision of a California court is obviously not binding on any other state. And hasn't anyone noticed that Florida's government is one of the most reactionary bunch of corrupt nutballs anywhere? (And I'm speaking as a Texan when I say that )

I've always been shocked by people shooting Florida. I just figured that they were paying the younger Bush to do it. How can that Bush can't run for office if people are shooting porn in his state. I don't think any smart person wants to be President after Dubya because there is no good way to clean up his mess but come 1012 or 2016 younger Bush is going to be the candidate and Florida will already be Theocracy and the model of the campaign.

[PR_Tom]

I dont think that it stems from paying someone to perform in a real shoot, or porn movie. The thing went down when they were paid to have sex at a private party that was not filmed. That was from the informant. So it could be bad for them, but not bad for porn producers in general (which I think is what people should probably hope for? I dunno)

Again it was laid out a bit better in the original article. They arrested them after the informant told them about the private party evidently. That one is going to stick unless the informant was/is a total unbelieveable flake on the stand I guess.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

I dont think that it stems from paying someone to perform in a real shoot, or porn movie. The thing went down when they were paid to have sex at a private party that was not filmed. That was from the informant. So it could be bad for them, but not bad for porn producers in general (which I think is what people should probably hope for? I dunno)

Again it was laid out a bit better in the original article. They arrested them after the informant told them about the private party evidently. That one is going to stick unless the informant was/is a total unbelieveable flake on the stand I guess.

That would change everything. Take the camera out of the "picture" and I think it would be considered prostitution. Jesus, even a simple tape recorder would have protected them.

[Greenguy]

I think I remember what I heard about the California thing (and this is probably incorrect, so pay no attention to me)

California is the only place in the US that you can make porn movies & videos that involve real sex acts. I think that every other place in the US has to have "simulated sex acts" in the wording for the release.

[karomesis]

Is that some sort of bizzaro world where the 1st Amendment doesn't exist?

of course, it's called the bush presidency.

since politicains are so fucking good at making useless laws to protect ignorant people, I think they should at least have the decency to sign a bill that would require the president to be able to communicate better than rain man. And have the decency to install a police state dictatorship in his first term in office so we can settle in and get used to having no freedoms.

This shit has GOT TO STOP . The FSC is a good tool, but I fear it is in need of a more amophorous position on certain issues, they can't attack what isn't there. Instead of using disinformation like the politicians are fond of doing, I think a novel and revolutionary idea is needed, it's called..........the truth.|shocking| We need to change public opinion, that is where the battle must be fought, for the hearts and minds of the citizenry.

[WarBot]

Originally Posted by Greenie

I think I remember what I heard about the California thing (and this is probably incorrect, so pay no attention to me)

California is the only place in the US that you can make porn movies & videos that involve real sex acts. I think that every other place in the US has to have "simulated sex acts" in the wording for the release.

OIC

[Kinky]

here is an article from 2005 that kinda explains it a bit WarBot

http://www.sexwork.com/legal/pornorprostitution.html

I thought it was an intersting read

[WarBot]

Thanks for that. I get it now. I will never understand how its anyones business if I pay some chick to have sex with me or if I pay 2 people to have sex. You want to talk about religeon effecting law in the united states, theres a perfect example. Who does it hurt? Why do they care?

[Kinky]

Originally Posted by WarBot

Thanks for that. I get it now. I will never understand how its anyones business if I pay some chick to have sex with me or if I pay 2 people to have sex. You want to talk about religeon effecting law in the united states, theres a perfect example. Who does it hurt? Why do they care?

for some reason it hurts the children

and they care because really religious people with money are sorta nuts

[swedguy]

They seem to be up and running again...

"Subject: [nats] SIGNUP via EPOCH"



http://www.cumonherface.com/
http://www.cashtitans.com/

[Ramster]

The good news is I didn't lose that long time member who joined using ccbill:
$12.47 (join date) 24 Nov 2001 (first rebill) 25 Dec 2001

[frankthetank]

Originally Posted by Ramster

The good news is I didn't lose that long time member who joined using ccbill:
$12.47 (join date) 24 Nov 2001 (first rebill) 25 Dec 2001

Is he into facials or did he just forget how to cancel?

[Greenguy]

Have they posted/released anything official? Along the lines of "All is well, sites are working, you'll get paid, etc"?

[jimatcohf]

If you have anything to do whatsoever with the adult industry, you will want to read this entire post. I am making this post to offer my view and to update our industry on the latest news of the arrest of Ray Guhn and several members of the www.cumonherface.com and www.cashtitans.com team and how it can affect you. For those that are not aware of the arrests, here are the links to those articles http://www.xbiz.com/news_piece.php?i...ing=ray%20guhn and http://www.xbiz.com/news_piece.php?i...ing=ray%20guhn

Most of you know me as Jim Manley or Big Jim. For those of you trying to picture who I am here is the most memorable pic of me brought to you by JFK http://www.fubarwebmasters.com/curre...pbp/z02847.htm now that was a great night and memory that I will cherish forever.

Ok, first, I am not really able to comment on the facts of the case only to say that Ray Guhn’s legal team will be fighting these charges aggressively as long as the money holds out. Ray has retained the legal team of Weston, Garrou, DeWitt & Walters. The well known and respected Larry Walters plans to spearhead a vigorous 1st amendment defense as you can imagine. Now please carefully read this next part. The predicate on which Ray Guhn and associates are charged can seriously impact how YOU as webmasters, producers, hosting companies, affiliates, and pay site owners will be permitted, or not permitted, to conduct your business in the future. The cops are claiming that paying people to perform sexually on camera is prostitution and therefore illegal. If the prosecution wins the Ray Guhn case in Florida it will have the chilling effect of setting precedent of illegalizing porn production throughout Florida which in turn will eagerly be used by other states anxious to squelch free expression to justify filing suits or applying pressure against webmasters, producers, hosters, affiliates and site owners who engage in showing ‘paid performers engaging in sex while being photographed or videotaped or on webcam’.

1) Why the charge of Racketeering? As mentioned, the cops assert that compensating people who perform in, or produce, adult sexual content is prostitution and that any parties earning an income derived from activity based on prostitution is Racketeering (which carries up to 30 years in jail). The 2nd predicate they are using is an Obscenity charge, ie: that COHF content is stronger content than Pensacola community standards allow, even though you can walk into dozens of stores in Pensacola and purchase many different porn mags showing detailed glossy images of group sex, anal sex, triple penetration, bondage sex, dildo sex, lesbian strap on sex, oral sex, cum swapping and oral/facial cumshots. But we all know how vague the obscenity law is, depending on your locale a girl posing nude could be considered obscene by a conservative jury.
2) Don’t believe everything you read in the papers, the guns they seized at Ray’s home were all legally owned along with a weapons permit and the “drugs” were only one medication type legally prescribed by licensed physicians. But it made for a sensational byline in the article.
3) It’s Election year here. So the stronger the headlines, the better, as far as the guys running for reelection are concerned.

I really can’t comment more on the case but after reading some of the posts when this story broke on GFY and other boards I wanted to clear up a few confused posters who poked fun at this situation without understanding how THIS CASE is the landmark case that many in the adult industry have been fearing for years. Grave consequences will occur first in Florida and next industry wide if the prosecution prevails in reclassifying porn performers and actors… as prostitutes. If performers are reclassified as prostitutes, smart money says the law will next move to classify people like YOU who webmaster, produce, host, manage, or resell that ‘illegal’ content as criminals and racketeers. (remember, racketeering carries up to 30 years in jail!).

Attorney Larry Walters has set up a legal defense fund for this fight. I am asking everyone to donate to this fund, not just to help defend Ray and myself, but also to preserve our adult internet industry as we currently know it. This case is already creating expenditures in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and honestly guys we need industry financial help from our friends, associates, fellow businessmen and industry moguls to win this battle... for all of us. Please donate directly to Larry Walter’s firm at: www.RayGuhnDefenseFund.com NONE of the donations go to Ray, myself or COHF.
I can only hope that the generosity (and sense of self preservation) of our industry will shine in this moment of darkness and contributions will flow in to assist defending against these charges. Please read this article concerning this case as it was posted on AVN http://www.avn.com/index.php?Primary...tent_ID=270764 I hope that after reading this you will understand that this is much more than just another case against a few guys in Florida, but rather it is a veiled legal attempt to begin the process of outlawing all porn production not only in Florida, but eventually reaching across the country.

www.RayGuhnDefenseFund.com

On a personal note I wish to thank the industry for their support and emails and phone calls and im’s about this situation. I am truly grateful of everyone’s concern. I now understand what it means to be at the bottom of the barrel as I have lost everything, my job, my income and for the few that knew I had a daughter as of now the state has ended my rights to see her, so again if you don’t think this case is important for those of you who have children, please imagine not being able to see them again simply because you operated or worked for an adult business. If you think for one second it can’t happen to you as I did, WELL IT CAN! I am not sure if I will stay in the adult industry after all this is over. I have to consider the options and what I might have to do to regain custody of my daughter. I would like to talk to anyone that might need a general manager type, employee or sales rep to weigh my options. I will consider all offers as I have stated before I have no income and my savings is almost gone.

I will respond as I can to the replies of this thread I ask that it be bumped quite regularly if possible to keep this subject fresh in the minds of all webmasters.

Thank you in advance for your donations (www.RayGuhnDefenseFund.com) and emotional support and let’s ALL hope that when the sun sets Ray Guhn and his legal team’s fight to preserve our 1st Amendment freedoms for the adult industry are successful. Truth and the 1st amendment are on our side. The best 1st amendment team in the country is on the case, but the effort needs donations now to the legal fund to avoid being railroaded into a defeat that will shake the foundation of the adult industry.

Andy Craft aka Jim Manley
My old email is now gone so if you have it please delete and use iluvlivebabes@hotmail.com that is also my msn name and my ICQ # is 318490299