Signing up for Internext - Page 2

Chop Smith · 2005-03-27, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Useless Warrior

We should arrange our own show. We could camp out at Chop's place, have a bon fire, go skinny dipping, and lay drunk and naked under the stars.

Sounds like a good plan to me.

Seriously, I think some us should get together and throw a GG&J meeting. I went to the first Chicago meeting that Dr B and Surfn put on. To me that was better than Vegas.

Useless · 2005-03-27, 06:00 PM

For me, it's all about whether or not it is worth the investment. The only thing I want to do is meet my fellow webmasters. Period. I just want to sit down and relax with a bunch of the people I chat with here on a daily basis. It doesn't seem that AVN's plans mesh with mine.

$250 just to wander amongst the shiny sponsor posters? Bah humbug.

Chop Smith · 2005-03-27, 06:09 PM

More than one trip to the floor was as useless as a tit on a bull. The contacts at the hosipality suites and private parties were priceless.

RawAlex · 2005-03-28, 01:51 AM

That is why they are moving to "secure the facility" as it were, and charge you to access ANY PART OF THE SHOW, including the show lobby, the bar area, the pool area, etc.

Clearly, AVN has figured out that more and more of the business of the show is being conducted off the show floor, in the bars, at the pool, in the lobby, in the events, and around the area. They are also understanding that a whole hotel takeover gives them the potential to sell advertising space and better control the overall situation from end to end.

I think you will see even more events held this year directly at the hotel, that AVN will work at least minor deals to assure that the fun stays right on premises, and that the leeches who have hung around the lobbies and bars in the past shows can't get in. They will forcibly increase their paid attendance by making it all but impossible to be a leech.

Net bottom line, at the end of the day, AVN will make more money from the show. The positive side being that the people you see at the show will all have had to eitehr pay $250 or have kissed $250 worth of ass to get there.

What this will mean for the overall show is another question. Obviously there will be issues about getting a badge, I see the potential that badges will be mailed BEFORE the show even starts, which could be interesting.

Every year we bitch, every year we go. Could this be the year that it all changes?

Alex

Useless · 2005-03-28, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RawAlex

The positive side being that the people you see at the show will all have had to eitehr pay $250 or have kissed $250 worth of ass to get there.

Whose ass shall I start kissing then? For a schmoe like me, it just isn't worth the investment. Perhaps that is small-minded of me to say, but nothing I've seen or read has convinced me that the AVN show is worth attending for the average webmaster.

The 'show' is most definately geared toward programs owner's and a handful of big traffic movers. Why would I pay to be bombarded with sponsor advertising? I could go to GFY for free. Every time I visit the Internext site I click away feeling that I've been disenfranchised.

Cleo · 2005-03-28, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Every year we bitch, every year we go.

I skipped the Vegas show this year as I plan on skipping again next year.

emmanuelle · 2005-03-28, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Useless Warrior

Whose ass shall I start kissing then? For a schmoe like me, it just isn't worth the investment.

If you have a good relationship with a show sponsor or booth holder, you might find them willing to give you a pass. Last year PussyCash gave out a LOT of comped passes.

FYI- Generally those who have a booth get a handful of free passes with it, and then can purchase additional passes at a substantial discount.
Most affiliate programs are more than happy to help you with something like this if you are sending them lots of sales.

Trax · 2005-03-28, 08:58 AM

I'm looking forward to miami.. should be a blast.

Greenguy · 2005-03-28, 09:06 AM

I think that part of the problem is that Joe Blow webmaster shouldn't have to come up with a pile of cash to go to these things.

I'm guessing that it's about $1000 minimum to go per person with the badge, hotel & airfare. Then throw in the cost of the food & drink at the hotel (which is fucking ridiculous) & you're probably looking at $2500 for 2 people for the 4 days.

I'd rather take the $2500 I was gonna spend & throw a big party at my house for those that didn't want to cough up that much money for the show.

Simon · 2005-03-28, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenguy

I'd rather take the $2500 I was gonna spend & throw a big party at my house for those that didn't want to cough up that much money for the show.

Talk about the opposite of South Florida!

Hey, maybe we can do a winter retreat up there. Damn, only time I was in Buffalo was the big storm in late 70s. My friend and his brother dropped their little brother out the second floor window with a shovel and he disappeared into the snowbank. Then he tunnneled to the front door so they could open it. Damn that was some week.
Would Buffalo in the winter be better than an AVN-lockdown event?
You betcha!

Simon

Greenguy · 2005-03-28, 10:47 AM

We have one blizzard 28 years ago & that's all anyone ever talks about - LOL

Torn Rose · 2005-03-28, 10:57 AM

I got nailed by that '77/'78 blizzard as well....

I remember standing on the snow bank on the side of the road looking down on the school bus top...

docholly · 2005-03-28, 11:08 AM

I was in the city at the time.. we had snow over the cars for 1 day.. then manhattan was cleared. by the 3rd day it was filthy piled on the sidewalks of buildings that didn't have doormen to wash it away.

Buffalo in August would be a more pleasant alternative than steamy Miami or Vegas even in "but its a dry heat".

of course for that same 2500 you could have a ROCKING awesome time here and probably leave with a few extra $$

Trev · 2005-03-28, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torn

I got nailed by that '77/'78 blizzard as well....

I remember standing on the snow bank on the side of the road looking down on the school bus top...

I made some good money on that storm. A friend and I had access to a rubber wheeled frontend loader/grader tractor. We headed up to where the doctors, lawyers, indian chiefs lived and did a bunch of those long and/or cirular drives

(and we only damaged one garage lol )

Aly · 2005-03-28, 05:29 PM

Righto...

The first point I need to make here, because I believe it's the most crucial, is that while Internext is owned by AVN it is not run by AVN Online employees.
The trade show department here at the office only runs trade shows. They run Internext, AEE (the AVN show), EroticaLA and an upcoming sex toy business convention. You're right, Jim, when you say they don't belong in the online business; they aren't in the online business, they're in the trade show business...
That's part of a large issue really. The people who run Internext don't have as deep a knowledge of the adult industry as you and I do. But it's not really their jobs to.
I have to face that - by perception, Internext is AVN, and AVN is Internext (and perception is everything), so when Internext demonstrates a limited understanding of the online adult marketplace, it reflects poorly on AVN. And vice versa... when AVN fucks something up (say, with AVNAds for example) it reflects badly on Internext.
It's tricky.

Moving right along...

Demographic Information:

Demographic information is requested of all attendees in order to give sponsors a picture of who attends the event, and also to assure that the event (seminars etc) is tailored to the appropriate demographic. If, for example, 85% of respondents were content producers, then the events would cater to that market segment more, and market itself more aggressively to others. So, this information is requested at registration.

Location:

Yes Alex, thanks, the Diplomat Hotel in Florida is cheaper for all when we have that many webmasters in one location. That's the hard part with vegas, it's far more expensive and very hard to get everyone in one place. Here's an interesting fact, even with the move to the Mandalay Bay this year, the percentage of attendees actually staying at the event hotel remained almost exactly the same as last year. It didn't feel like it though...

After each show, all attendees with a legitimate email address on their registration receive a follow-up survey. PLEASE fill out this survey and suggest alternate locations for the event if you'd like, I've confirmed that the question will be included on the post summer internext survey.

Selling Lists:

If you get scanned by a pretty girl at Internext, that 'scanner' gets your contact info... That's the point of that thing. If you don't want them to scan you, feel free to take a Sharpie (not Faye) to your barcode. Who cares?! HOWEVER, Internext (and I just checked this for the millionth time) doesn't sell, rent or anything the registration info or attendee lists. Infact, IMO they're negligently good about it... but that's another story. So, no, 'AVN' is not selling their lists (those idiots!)

Other Shows:

Feel free to start a coalition and start your own show. Good luck with that.
AVN AND Internext have great relationships with the other shows and we all support eachother back and forth... Feel free to start something new and join the family.

Badge Cost:

Alex also covered this perfectly on GFY. The badge cost is $250 with early registration. That's a lot more than it was last year. Last year, the trade show itself was the revenue source... that's why people had to exhibit in order to throw 'official' events, otherwise, they would have been 'leeching' off the event. But lots of people wanted to be involved and have events and so on without having a booth, so that requirement was removed. That does, however, amount to a serious loss in revenue (including that necessary to cover basic costs) for the show. So, to even this all out, attendance in any way now has a flat fee. That fee covers entry to all events, including exhibits and seminars and so on. And, yes, the nice folks at Internext are also having wireless access added to the entire event.

To Go or Not to Go to The Show:

Last year, 73% of respondents said they met or exceeded their business objectives at the show. That's not bad considering the relaxed environment and number of open bars... I've always found it to be worthwhile and fun myself, but feel free to skip it... unless you're name's GreenGuy... in which case, please don't!

CHOP SMITH: "More than one trip to the floor was as useless as a tit on a bull. The contacts at the hosipality suites and private parties were priceless." Well, $250 to access the hotel is probably a GOOD deal then! LOL..

Useless Warrior:

I haven't 'munched dick' in a long time... sorry our plans don't mesh...

Don't hesitate to contact me anytime... or keep posting!

Greenguy · 2005-03-28, 05:55 PM

Just remember, I do love ya Aly

Demographic Information:
The old form was fine - name, address, occupation, cc info. The rest of it is just info that no one truly needs to know. Why would anyone need to know how many sites I have? How much money I make? How much traffic I have? How much I plan to spend?

Location:
I think part of the "location" problem is that you have it in Miami in August (hurricanes & heat come to mind) and in Vegas in Jan right after the New Year - Vegas is pretty much popular all year round, but with New Years Eve being one of their high points, the time right after is of course a low point. So each convention is at a time of the year that is slow & thus, cheap. But the rates don't seem to be discounted at all. And using the travel agency of Vegas is a rip off, especially if you gamble, because they won't comp the room if you booked it thru a travel agent

Badge Cost:
Your explanation sounds as if you're passing off the costs to the webmasters with the new rules as far as allowing parties without booths & whatnot and that doesn't seem fair at all. And it's not like it was 4 or 5 years ago - the badge really means shit for most of the parties. We all know that you need VIP passes to get in to most of them & VIP VIP passes if you want a couple free drinks from the bars. This is NOT really AVN's fault, but it really does decrease the value of the badge.

I have another questions - seeing as the "press" gets in for free, does this site quality for this & how many free passes can I get? I have a large staff

Jim · 2005-03-28, 05:56 PM

Thank you Aly

But, over the years, I have watched the shows grow smaller and get more expensive. It's easy to see why the price goes up. You have to pay a standard price and if fewer people kick in, the ones that do have to make that up. But, there seems to be a fundamental problem of a smaller attendance. Don't you agree that point should be addressed?

On these surveys...are you really saying that people say to keep the show in Florida in the middle of August? If so, that is such a strange coincidence with the fact that there probably is not a cheaper venue large enough or a worse time in the United States.

Like I said, the biggest problem seems to be the dwindling attendance. Wouldn't you agree that if the venue was changed or even change of date would make a huge impact on that problem? That's only with Florida in August. But, perhaps a date a little further from Christmas Day would help in Vegas as well.

Torn Rose · 2005-03-28, 06:00 PM

"After each show, all attendees with a legitimate email address on their registration receive a follow-up survey. PLEASE fill out this survey and suggest alternate locations for the event if you'd like, I've confirmed that the question will be included on the post summer internext survey."

I think I have to disagree with this, I have been to 6 shows and never once received anything like this, and yes, my contact information was 100% legit. I have heard a few mention it, but I have heard more asking if I got one, since they heard so and so got one and they didn’t get one.

As for not selling information, I will not argue, but I never once used a phone # I had for anything business related, until I registered with Internext (3 or 4 years ago) and by my own fault used that number and not a week after Internext I had phone calls from content producers who called me by my real name, which I only used at Internext registration and again, no one else had that phone number or information on my name.

I realize you have not been at AVN for very long, but I disagree with what I have seen and what you are told.

Aly · 2005-03-28, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torn

"After each show, all attendees with a legitimate email address on their registration receive a follow-up survey. PLEASE fill out this survey and suggest alternate locations for the event if you'd like, I've confirmed that the question will be included on the post summer internext survey."

I think I have to disagree with this, I have been to 6 shows and never once received anything like this, and yes, my contact information was 100% legit. I have heard a few mention it, but I have heard more asking if I got one, since they heard so and so got one and they didn’t get one.

As for not selling information, I will not argue, but I never once used a phone # I had for anything business related, until I registered with Internext (3 or 4 years ago) and by my own fault used that number and not a week after Internext I had phone calls from content producers who called me by my real name, which I only used at Internext registration and again, no one else had that phone number or information on my name.

I realize you have not been at AVN for very long, but I disagree with what I have seen and what you are told.

Thanks for letting me know.

Useless · 2005-03-28, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

The people who run Internext don't have as deep a knowledge of the adult industry as you and I do. But it's not really their jobs to.

Bullshit. How are they supposed to plan a tradeshow for the adult online community if they don't have the slightest concept ofwho we are and what we do? But that's fine, just let them go on fucking it up year after year. What the hell? Did Internext hire through the same agency as GW did for the planning of the war in Iraq?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

Demographic information is requested of all attendees in order to give sponsors a picture of who attends the event, and also to assure that the event (seminars etc) is tailored to the appropriate demographic.

And after all of these years...it's still a mess.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

Other Shows:

Feel free to start a coalition and start your own show. Good luck with that.

Aly, it's the not caring that hurts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

Badge Cost:

The badge cost is $250 with early registration.

It's too fucking much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

To Go or Not to Go to The Show:

Last year, 73% of respondents said they met or exceeded their business objectives at the show.

That's because everyone's expectations are so god damned low after years of Internext fucking up the show.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

CHOP SMITH: "More than one trip to the floor was as useless as a tit on a bull. The contacts at the hosipality suites and private parties were priceless." Well, $250 to access the hotel is probably a GOOD deal then!.

Don't quit your day job. You'd suck at car sales.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aly

Useless Warrior:

I haven't 'munched dick' in a long time... sorry our plans don't mesh...

That's a shame. At least then I could have come up with a reason to like you.

Now why don't you go back to work on new ways for both Internext and Adbrite to screw the common webmaster while telling us that it's not your job to know how these things work.

Aly · 2005-03-28, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

Thank you Aly

But, over the years, I have watched the shows grow smaller and get more expensive. It's easy to see why the price goes up. You have to pay a standard price and if fewer people kick in, the ones that do have to make that up. But, there seems to be a fundamental problem of a smaller attendance. Don't you agree that point should be addressed?

On these surveys...are you really saying that people say to keep the show in Florida in the middle of August? If so, that is such a strange coincidence with the fact that there probably is not a cheaper venue large enough or a worse time in the United States.

Like I said, the biggest problem seems to be the dwindling attendance. Wouldn't you agree that if the venue was changed or even change of date would make a huge impact on that problem? That's only with Florida in August. But, perhaps a date a little further from Christmas Day would help in Vegas as well.

I completely agree. Dwindling attendance is a concern, and moving the conference may well help.... but here's the thing... attendance itself has NOT declined in the past two years (exhibit size has). Especially for the summer show... Of course, with this whole new ball game maybe it will now, but that remains to be seen. I, personally, won't call it either way until after the event.

As far as the Florida show survey goes, they didn't ask the location question last year, which is why I have clarified they will this year. As for Vegas, respondents chose to stay in Vegas during the same time period as AEE; 48% attend that show too.

RawAlex · 2005-03-28, 06:54 PM

I am having a moment here aly and munching dick... Hmmm. Anyway!

Here is my take: As shows have evolved over the last 3 or 4 years, more and more stuff has happened off the show floor. The show floor is still an important place to visit at least once (to see what's up, meet people, etc), but there are many other parts to the shows now that didn't exist a few years back. Bars, social situations, hotel lobby, pool side, cabanas, and other events that are not directly on the show floor are now all powerful parts of the trade show.

This year in Vegas, it was very hard to get badges (and Aly knows how I felt about that one), and many people instead just set themselves up in the long hallway leading to the show and turned into show leeches. They saved themselves $250 and they still were able to do just about as much business as usual.

Last year in Florida, the leech factor was huge. Many people I saw "at the show" didn't have a badge, were sharing badges, or were using other tricks to get people in and out of show functions without paying. I truly think that about 20% of the people at the event were not actually part of the event.

The biggest mistake made is that the badge is for access to the show floor. In reality, the badge is your way of paying for the SITUATION created by the show. Florida more so than Vegas. It is a self contained adult webmasters and business person's best chance to meet new people, get deals done, and move ahead with projects. Cybernet, which is (from what I understand) a whole hotel takeover will be exactly the same sort of situation - a whole circumstance created to get you networking and moving ahead.

I don't like paying more. I don't like expensive drinks. I don't like "resort fees" when I know I ain't going to be resorting to anything other than the pool. I don't like that the changing buisness model of online adult shows is making it more expensive for me to attend.

However, the economics are there: less companies want a booth, more companies want social stuff, more companies want to do whatever, and as a result, all the income that use to come from floor space rental (at $2500-5000 per 10 x 10 square space) has to be picked up by the badgeholders and possibly by increased advertising space within the hotel. They too are running a business...

Am I happy? Nope. AVN tradeshow division needs to work harder to find other ways to make things work out, otherwise they may find themselves priced out of the tradeshow market.

Alex

Ramster · 2005-03-28, 07:08 PM

$250 just to get in? So after room costs, meals and drinks ($7 for a drink is ridiculas!!!) Greenguy is right. A regular everyday webmaster needs to dish out $2500 just to go to this show if they have to fly there too.

T Pat · 2005-03-28, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ramster

$250 just to get in? So after room costs, meals and drinks ($7 for a drink is ridiculas!!!) Greenguy is right. A regular everyday webmaster needs to dish out $2500 just to go to this show if they have to fly there too.

that just made my mind up.
I can buy alot of Cervazas for that kind of money
was going to do Phonex but plans changed
I enjoyed cybernetexpo last year and it's within walking distance of me this year.
Hell I can do cybernetexpo and YP for less than half the cost

emmanuelle · 2005-03-28, 09:54 PM

I'm not so sure that the issue here is $250, but the 67% increase over all previous years and the reasons for it. If it's an issue of losing booth revenue, then why not charge the party throwers an event fee? They are the ones most benefitting from the new rules.
The part about Internext being responsible for wireless access needs to be clarified. When I booked my room, I was told that I am being charged an extra $16/day/room fee for internet, and the useless shuttle bus.
I am thrilled that the 'leeches' will be weeded out, and the fans who stalk the webmodels might have less incentive to be there; but this 'lower-key' show is on the verge of becoming elitist. While we love the idea of having the place to ourselves, we are a captive audience and forced to pay hand over fist for basics like food & drink.
It sure makes me rethink bringing staff and models again.....

edit: I can back up Torn's story 100%- Phone calls like what he mentioned are common in the weeks following the shows.
I'm sure these callers appreciate all the demographic information that we are forced to give along with our credit card number.

2005-03-27, 06:00 PM	#27
Useless Certified Nice Person Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Dirty Undies, NY Posts: 11,268	For me, it's all about whether or not it is worth the investment. The only thing I want to do is meet my fellow webmasters. Period. I just want to sit down and relax with a bunch of the people I chat with here on a daily basis. It doesn't seem that AVN's plans mesh with mine. $250 just to wander amongst the shiny sponsor posters? Bah humbug. __________________ Click here to purchase a bridge I'm selling.

2005-03-27, 06:09 PM	#28
Chop Smith Eighteen 'til I Die Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,168	More than one trip to the floor was as useless as a tit on a bull. The contacts at the hosipality suites and private parties were priceless. __________________

2005-03-28, 08:58 AM	#33
Trax Hey, can you take the wheel for a second, I have to scratch my self in two places at once Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: 3rd Rock From Sun Posts: 181	I'm looking forward to miami.. should be a blast. __________________ Submit FS's to: MindBlowing Porn \| Fetish Links

2005-03-28, 09:06 AM	#34
Greenguy The Original Greenguy (Est'd 1996) & AVN HOF Member - I Crop Pics For Thumbs In My Sleep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Blasdell, NY (shithole suburb south of Buffalo) Posts: 41,929	I think that part of the problem is that Joe Blow webmaster shouldn't have to come up with a pile of cash to go to these things. I'm guessing that it's about $1000 minimum to go per person with the badge, hotel & airfare. Then throw in the cost of the food & drink at the hotel (which is fucking ridiculous) & you're probably looking at $2500 for 2 people for the 4 days. I'd rather take the $2500 I was gonna spend & throw a big party at my house for those that didn't want to cough up that much money for the show. __________________ Promote POV Porn Cash By Building & Submitting Galleries to the Porn Luv Network

2005-03-28, 10:47 AM	#36
Greenguy The Original Greenguy (Est'd 1996) & AVN HOF Member - I Crop Pics For Thumbs In My Sleep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Blasdell, NY (shithole suburb south of Buffalo) Posts: 41,929	We have one blizzard 28 years ago & that's all anyone ever talks about - LOL __________________ Promote POV Porn Cash By Building & Submitting Galleries to the Porn Luv Network

2005-03-28, 01:51 AM	#29
RawAlex Took the hint. Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 5,597	That is why they are moving to "secure the facility" as it were, and charge you to access ANY PART OF THE SHOW, including the show lobby, the bar area, the pool area, etc. Clearly, AVN has figured out that more and more of the business of the show is being conducted off the show floor, in the bars, at the pool, in the lobby, in the events, and around the area. They are also understanding that a whole hotel takeover gives them the potential to sell advertising space and better control the overall situation from end to end. I think you will see even more events held this year directly at the hotel, that AVN will work at least minor deals to assure that the fun stays right on premises, and that the leeches who have hung around the lobbies and bars in the past shows can't get in. They will forcibly increase their paid attendance by making it all but impossible to be a leech. Net bottom line, at the end of the day, AVN will make more money from the show. The positive side being that the people you see at the show will all have had to eitehr pay $250 or have kissed $250 worth of ass to get there. What this will mean for the overall show is another question. Obviously there will be issues about getting a badge, I see the potential that badges will be mailed BEFORE the show even starts, which could be interesting. Every year we bitch, every year we go. Could this be the year that it all changes? Alex

2005-03-28, 10:57 AM	#37
Torn Rose "Faith is believing what you know ain't so." ~ Mark Twain Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 4,806	I got nailed by that '77/'78 blizzard as well.... I remember standing on the snow bank on the side of the road looking down on the school bus top...

2005-03-28, 11:08 AM	#38
docholly Nothing funnier than the ridiculous faces you people make mid-coitus Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Sin-City USA Posts: 4,973	I was in the city at the time.. we had snow over the cars for 1 day.. then manhattan was cleared. by the 3rd day it was filthy piled on the sidewalks of buildings that didn't have doormen to wash it away. Buffalo in August would be a more pleasant alternative than steamy Miami or Vegas even in "but its a dry heat". of course for that same 2500 you could have a ROCKING awesome time here and probably leave with a few extra $$ __________________ Support Indie Porn Sites OMGoddess You know you need some Bling!!

2005-03-28, 05:29 PM	#40
Aly Aw, Dad, you've done a lot of great things, but you're a very old man, and old people are useless Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Hollywood Posts: 20	Righto... The first point I need to make here, because I believe it's the most crucial, is that while Internext is owned by AVN it is not run by AVN Online employees. The trade show department here at the office only runs trade shows. They run Internext, AEE (the AVN show), EroticaLA and an upcoming sex toy business convention. You're right, Jim, when you say they don't belong in the online business; they aren't in the online business, they're in the trade show business... That's part of a large issue really. The people who run Internext don't have as deep a knowledge of the adult industry as you and I do. But it's not really their jobs to. I have to face that - by perception, Internext is AVN, and AVN is Internext (and perception is everything), so when Internext demonstrates a limited understanding of the online adult marketplace, it reflects poorly on AVN. And vice versa... when AVN fucks something up (say, with AVNAds for example) it reflects badly on Internext. It's tricky. Moving right along... Demographic Information: Demographic information is requested of all attendees in order to give sponsors a picture of who attends the event, and also to assure that the event (seminars etc) is tailored to the appropriate demographic. If, for example, 85% of respondents were content producers, then the events would cater to that market segment more, and market itself more aggressively to others. So, this information is requested at registration. Location: Yes Alex, thanks, the Diplomat Hotel in Florida is cheaper for all when we have that many webmasters in one location. That's the hard part with vegas, it's far more expensive and very hard to get everyone in one place. Here's an interesting fact, even with the move to the Mandalay Bay this year, the percentage of attendees actually staying at the event hotel remained almost exactly the same as last year. It didn't feel like it though... After each show, all attendees with a legitimate email address on their registration receive a follow-up survey. PLEASE fill out this survey and suggest alternate locations for the event if you'd like, I've confirmed that the question will be included on the post summer internext survey. Selling Lists: If you get scanned by a pretty girl at Internext, that 'scanner' gets your contact info... That's the point of that thing. If you don't want them to scan you, feel free to take a Sharpie (not Faye) to your barcode. Who cares?! HOWEVER, Internext (and I just checked this for the millionth time) doesn't sell, rent or anything the registration info or attendee lists. Infact, IMO they're negligently good about it... but that's another story. So, no, 'AVN' is not selling their lists (those idiots!) Other Shows: Feel free to start a coalition and start your own show. Good luck with that. AVN AND Internext have great relationships with the other shows and we all support eachother back and forth... Feel free to start something new and join the family. Badge Cost: Alex also covered this perfectly on GFY. The badge cost is $250 with early registration. That's a lot more than it was last year. Last year, the trade show itself was the revenue source... that's why people had to exhibit in order to throw 'official' events, otherwise, they would have been 'leeching' off the event. But lots of people wanted to be involved and have events and so on without having a booth, so that requirement was removed. That does, however, amount to a serious loss in revenue (including that necessary to cover basic costs) for the show. So, to even this all out, attendance in any way now has a flat fee. That fee covers entry to all events, including exhibits and seminars and so on. And, yes, the nice folks at Internext are also having wireless access added to the entire event. To Go or Not to Go to The Show: Last year, 73% of respondents said they met or exceeded their business objectives at the show. That's not bad considering the relaxed environment and number of open bars... I've always found it to be worthwhile and fun myself, but feel free to skip it... unless you're name's GreenGuy... in which case, please don't! CHOP SMITH: "More than one trip to the floor was as useless as a tit on a bull. The contacts at the hosipality suites and private parties were priceless." Well, $250 to access the hotel is probably a GOOD deal then! LOL.. Useless Warrior: I haven't 'munched dick' in a long time... sorry our plans don't mesh... Don't hesitate to contact me anytime... or keep posting!

2005-03-28, 05:55 PM	#41
Greenguy The Original Greenguy (Est'd 1996) & AVN HOF Member - I Crop Pics For Thumbs In My Sleep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Blasdell, NY (shithole suburb south of Buffalo) Posts: 41,929	Just remember, I do love ya Aly Demographic Information: The old form was fine - name, address, occupation, cc info. The rest of it is just info that no one truly needs to know. Why would anyone need to know how many sites I have? How much money I make? How much traffic I have? How much I plan to spend? Location: I think part of the "location" problem is that you have it in Miami in August (hurricanes & heat come to mind) and in Vegas in Jan right after the New Year - Vegas is pretty much popular all year round, but with New Years Eve being one of their high points, the time right after is of course a low point. So each convention is at a time of the year that is slow & thus, cheap. But the rates don't seem to be discounted at all. And using the travel agency of Vegas is a rip off, especially if you gamble, because they won't comp the room if you booked it thru a travel agent Badge Cost: Your explanation sounds as if you're passing off the costs to the webmasters with the new rules as far as allowing parties without booths & whatnot and that doesn't seem fair at all. And it's not like it was 4 or 5 years ago - the badge really means shit for most of the parties. We all know that you need VIP passes to get in to most of them & VIP VIP passes if you want a couple free drinks from the bars. This is NOT really AVN's fault, but it really does decrease the value of the badge. I have another questions - seeing as the "press" gets in for free, does this site quality for this & how many free passes can I get? I have a large staff __________________ Promote POV Porn Cash By Building & Submitting Galleries to the Porn Luv Network

2005-03-28, 05:56 PM	#42
Jim Banned Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mohawk, New York Posts: 19,477	Thank you Aly But, over the years, I have watched the shows grow smaller and get more expensive. It's easy to see why the price goes up. You have to pay a standard price and if fewer people kick in, the ones that do have to make that up. But, there seems to be a fundamental problem of a smaller attendance. Don't you agree that point should be addressed? On these surveys...are you really saying that people say to keep the show in Florida in the middle of August? If so, that is such a strange coincidence with the fact that there probably is not a cheaper venue large enough or a worse time in the United States. Like I said, the biggest problem seems to be the dwindling attendance. Wouldn't you agree that if the venue was changed or even change of date would make a huge impact on that problem? That's only with Florida in August. But, perhaps a date a little further from Christmas Day would help in Vegas as well.

2005-03-28, 06:00 PM	#43
Torn Rose "Faith is believing what you know ain't so." ~ Mark Twain Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 4,806	"After each show, all attendees with a legitimate email address on their registration receive a follow-up survey. PLEASE fill out this survey and suggest alternate locations for the event if you'd like, I've confirmed that the question will be included on the post summer internext survey." I think I have to disagree with this, I have been to 6 shows and never once received anything like this, and yes, my contact information was 100% legit. I have heard a few mention it, but I have heard more asking if I got one, since they heard so and so got one and they didn’t get one. As for not selling information, I will not argue, but I never once used a phone # I had for anything business related, until I registered with Internext (3 or 4 years ago) and by my own fault used that number and not a week after Internext I had phone calls from content producers who called me by my real name, which I only used at Internext registration and again, no one else had that phone number or information on my name. I realize you have not been at AVN for very long, but I disagree with what I have seen and what you are told.

2005-03-28, 06:54 PM	#47
RawAlex Took the hint. Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 5,597	I am having a moment here aly and munching dick... Hmmm. Anyway! Here is my take: As shows have evolved over the last 3 or 4 years, more and more stuff has happened off the show floor. The show floor is still an important place to visit at least once (to see what's up, meet people, etc), but there are many other parts to the shows now that didn't exist a few years back. Bars, social situations, hotel lobby, pool side, cabanas, and other events that are not directly on the show floor are now all powerful parts of the trade show. This year in Vegas, it was very hard to get badges (and Aly knows how I felt about that one), and many people instead just set themselves up in the long hallway leading to the show and turned into show leeches. They saved themselves $250 and they still were able to do just about as much business as usual. Last year in Florida, the leech factor was huge. Many people I saw "at the show" didn't have a badge, were sharing badges, or were using other tricks to get people in and out of show functions without paying. I truly think that about 20% of the people at the event were not actually part of the event. The biggest mistake made is that the badge is for access to the show floor. In reality, the badge is your way of paying for the SITUATION created by the show. Florida more so than Vegas. It is a self contained adult webmasters and business person's best chance to meet new people, get deals done, and move ahead with projects. Cybernet, which is (from what I understand) a whole hotel takeover will be exactly the same sort of situation - a whole circumstance created to get you networking and moving ahead. I don't like paying more. I don't like expensive drinks. I don't like "resort fees" when I know I ain't going to be resorting to anything other than the pool. I don't like that the changing buisness model of online adult shows is making it more expensive for me to attend. However, the economics are there: less companies want a booth, more companies want social stuff, more companies want to do whatever, and as a result, all the income that use to come from floor space rental (at $2500-5000 per 10 x 10 square space) has to be picked up by the badgeholders and possibly by increased advertising space within the hotel. They too are running a business... Am I happy? Nope. AVN tradeshow division needs to work harder to find other ways to make things work out, otherwise they may find themselves priced out of the tradeshow market. Alex

2005-03-28, 07:08 PM	#48
Ramster Life is good Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 11,867	$250 just to get in? So after room costs, meals and drinks ($7 for a drink is ridiculas!!!) Greenguy is right. A regular everyday webmaster needs to dish out $2500 just to go to this show if they have to fly there too. __________________ Pornstar Legends \| Live Cam Model Shows \| Hungarian Girls Skype: robmurray999

2005-03-28, 09:54 PM	#50
emmanuelle 0100011101100101011001010 1101011001000000100001101 1010000110100101100011 Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Montreal Posts: 1,441	I'm not so sure that the issue here is $250, but the 67% increase over all previous years and the reasons for it. If it's an issue of losing booth revenue, then why not charge the party throwers an event fee? They are the ones most benefitting from the new rules. The part about Internext being responsible for wireless access needs to be clarified. When I booked my room, I was told that I am being charged an extra $16/day/room fee for internet, and the useless shuttle bus. I am thrilled that the 'leeches' will be weeded out, and the fans who stalk the webmodels might have less incentive to be there; but this 'lower-key' show is on the verge of becoming elitist. While we love the idea of having the place to ourselves, we are a captive audience and forced to pay hand over fist for basics like food & drink. It sure makes me rethink bringing staff and models again..... edit: I can back up Torn's story 100%- Phone calls like what he mentioned are common in the weeks following the shows. I'm sure these callers appreciate all the demographic information that we are forced to give along with our credit card number.