need clarification on rule change at penis bot
 

not sure if they are active or not here but maybe you guys can clarify their new rules if they arent around to give it to me from the horses mouth

as of the 27th of jan their rules state: does that mean only the index.html page (folder default) or do you think that means just an index page that could be mirrored?

lol sec_man just submit real index and your be save!!! lo, Beef just find out, she submitted an warning and didnt get thru, index.html will do

wtf is the point of doing that? i mean its not going to help link pop, not going to make sure they get listed on the same page as the big boys, i mean all its doing is making submitters build mirrored folders for each site with only the index.html page in them. it just doesnt make sense to me - someone please explain before i loose my mind |angry|

mmmmm i dont see a problem you sound like beef a bit, hell just make some folders copie and you have what 5 index pages, ??? i still think more linksites will ask real index pages in furture, and dont think a nuthad is answering you.........you know bette that that...........

yeah ive noticed that alot of linklists are doing this, thats why i want to know why. it is a pain in the ass to do it this way - i have to change a fucking million templates and recode the macro that does my se terms - i can do it but why the fuck should i if no one is getting a benifit from it. makes me want to tell penis bot to fuck off and just stop submitting to them

hahahaha sec_man, i have heard beef telling me that this evening, but i dont see the probem, go wth the flowwwwwwwww, bizz is changing................

because its stupid.

unless there is a reason to do it that i cant think of then they are just making a rule for the sake of making a rule and thats just plain stupid imho

i dont have a problem changing when there is a reason to - niche specific recips are a perfect example, but if there isnt a reason then i dont want to waste my time conforming the way i do things to the whims and fancies of every linklist owner on the net.

am i crazy to think that way? i dunno, but thats why im asking...
why
are they changing their rules?

i dont know.........maybe because its getting a bit harder this year? low dollar i get the shit of the dollar i get what 16 euro of every 35 dollar i make, hell that sucks huge........but thats bizz, all are trying to survive?????? visa change and all??? i dont know, i just go with the flow, i can naggg......it wont make me money .......work thats what makes me money, bizz change alot its not the same as 6 years ago, i heard stories(wich i love , you could make tons of money with one free site 6 years ago) do i regret i wasnt there 6 years ago, no i wont.........i choose this bizz almost 3 years ago and i go with the flow, alot of changes monthy, changing sponsor links and all, i am getting sick of it, but i still work and change............... they have their reason, i dont care they dont have to tell me........i just go with the flowwwwwww

Sec_man, basically they are saying they are big enough that they shouldn't have to be placed on mirrored pages. And they are right.

Mirrored pages are only good for the smaller linklists, if you do them at all.

why do you say that? i have always put greenguy and richard and smut gremlin and many others on mirror pages - if penis bot is wanting to be listed with them then they need to say that. i dont list any big linklists on my index.html mirror (no offence to any listed on my index.html page LOL)

like i said before all you have to do is make mirrored folders and you bypass that whole issue, it just seems counter productive imho

Well there are several issues here, but the most important is optimizing for google and the benefits of the index page in google. All other things being equal, google tends to rank index pages higher, and regard them as more valuable.

Just because Greenguy and Smutgremlins are damn nice folks and will give you a listing from a mirrored page doesn't make it optimum. Penisbot is trying to come in from behind, their whole strategy is to optimize for google, so they are wisely saying don't put us on mirrored pages please.

Now me, I don't mirror pages at all, nor do I submit to the hundreds a little link lists. It's a waste of time and money. Building a free site that has a chance of doing well in google is better in terms of total earning for that free site in the long run.

I said this once on Greenys old message board about 3 years ago, and every little link list owner jumped down my throat bitching me out. Only two of those guys are still here and in business, and one dosn't own little linklists any longer, because they are too much trouble, not enough profit.

A free site with a bunch of nearly identical mirrored pages looks like a doorway site to google, and it will tend to get devalued.

Bill,

having made that argument countless times on many boards... you are "beating a dead horse".. :(

For some reason they simply dont want to listen to valid arguments..

I too never build mirrors, and only submit to a select list of linklists

DD

I agree. Pick 16-20 solid linklist that you know you get listed at. Get to know the owners. Not making a bunch of subfolders is also good for SE traffic

If you do your mirrors right every one can be on the index :)

I don't submit to a real lot of links lists but I do submit to more then just the really big ones and do very well with sales from some of the smaller list, often better then I do off of the larger lists.

PenisBot has a really great spot for porn over at Google so I guess they can pretty much ask for whatever kind of recip they want.

But in the end isn't it really about getting and listing good sites with good design and content that the surfer wants to see?

thats kindof what i am asking cleo, how much difference in googles eyes is there between the index of four or five mirrored folders index pages and four or five mirrored warning pages?

im not disputing whether or not they can do what they did, im trying to figure out what good its going to do me. not to sound selfish but thats the only reason i take the time to submit to any linklist in the first place, yknow?

when megaporn links put up the rule that they wanted to be listed with at least three of a list of 8 or so it made sense cuz i got something out of it - this seems to be alot of work for very little gain.

that is why i am asking tho, i dont know and i am wondering if it will benefit me by making mirrored folders vs mirrored warning pages.

I don't mirror for LL's.

I do for TGP's ;)

I guess you must have some strategy I don't yet understand for your index pages, because for the life of me I can't understand why anyone would want to deny their best index page for penisbot quality traffic and linking.

There are about a dozen sites that will send 95% of the total traffic your site will see from linklists. why they shouldn't be linked on your index is a mystery to me. Most pass on decent pr and while they don't always seem to be a big help in search engine positioning they don't hurt.

I still tend to reserve the root index of my domains for a search engine strategy that usually keeps me from putting link list links on the root index. But I'm planning to do more of that, link list linking to roots, in the future. Just to get more measurements on what effect it has.

im not talking abuot the root index of my domains im talking about the root index of my free sites which are all subfolders of the root domain - thats why im confused as to the benefits.

as to a strategy, kindof - the only linklists i put on my index are the ones who allow popups, fpas before content, and pics on html. if that page does do better in se placement i want to make sure that i can convert the traffic as effectively as i can with the tools i have availible to me. i sure as hell dont want a site that conforms to penisbots rules in a good se spot - im not looking for bookmarkers, yknow?

as to passing on decent pr, sure, and they would pass on a decent pr to any mirror page i submit to them. like i said if they wanted to be listed with all the big linklists then ask for that like mega porn links did - his rule at least gave me some kind of benefit.

again - im not lambasting them for changing their rules, ultimately its their choice and i can always just not submit to them, but i would like to at least understand what their reasoning was

All of my warning pages are index pages. Non are fake and non are anymore real then any others.

I find my biggest expense is content so I build a lot of stuff out of each set that I buy and I don't reuse it.

I give PenisBot a good recip on a page that has other large lists on it and build clean sites with fresh content that are easy to navigate and try to make each one unique, I never reuse a design without tweaking it first.

I get good listings so I'm happy and I guess I guess the places that I submit to are happy seeing as they list my stuff.

It is pretty amazing that Penisbot is number one for porn over at Google so they are doing something right. :)

Yes, well that clarifies things. That reason makes perfect sense to me, in fact I do something like it at times myself.

I've built two versions of many sites, on two seperate folders, one with dmoz grade advertising (a console and a fpa), one with the fussier linklist grade advertising.

Neither consoles or fpas are as efficient sales tools as they once were, so I do it less these days. You have to build variations between the two sites or google will tend to devalue them, thats the reason I don't do it so often these days, better to concentrate my work on one optimized site. (and dmoz isn't so important these days.

Anyway, that is a decent reason to want to conserve an index.

I don't bother with mirrors at all. I submit to 8 or so LLs out of a list of about 20 so that every free site doesn't have the exact same links. Trying to be more random seems to be helping with SEO. Plus I don't have the trouble getting listed some people complain about.

Hello guys!
We decided to add this rule after close exploring of submitting results for doorway pages with "enter.html , warning.html , etc." at the end or URL. Nobody list em among big LL's like:
Link-o-Rama
Richards-Realm
Tommys-Bookmarks
MegaPornLinks
PK
Hoes
DD

They are not list those sites. And we decided don't list em too. I'm not sure, this is 100% rule in LL's mentioned above, but at least 90%.

okay, if the reason to make the rule is to be on the page with big linklists then do it like mega porn links did and ask to be with them. right now if i submit the mirror page with the big boys on it to you then you will reject it. if i submit the index.html page to you the big boys arent on it at all so you will prolly reject it too.

im in a catch 22 here - and thats why i wanted the clarification. if i submit warning.html to you with all the "big boys" on it even though its not index.html will you list me or reject me?

the other problem is that your rules arent the same as greenguy, richard, mega pornl inks, jaysXXX and the rest. they allow pics on html pages and you dont so i will never be able to put you on the same mirror as them.

if your going to demand to be put on the same page as other linklists please dont tie my hands by making your rules more strict than them... cuz now i have to decide if being listed on your site is more important than the ad space i get on html pages that full sized pics are on which all of them allow.

i did always mirror my sites, but lately i dont have time to make free sites, i am working on to many projects, to be real my last free site is submitted to only 8 linksites, i dont have trouble with the rules Ll ask....its their site , who am i to tell them how to handle their site? i dont see a problem

thats great stu, i do have a problem and i am trying to resolve it so i am asking. Quit telling me to go with the flow cuz i cant without fucking someone.

right now i can do one of three things

1) submit something that penis bot will get traffic from and i will get listed with

2) submit the index.html page with bogus recips to greenguy, richards, and several others so that penis bot will list me but i will just be fucking them, which i dont want to do,

3) stop submitting to penis bot all together

i think the best of all of those options would be the first one but right now i (and many other webmasters) cant do that without loosing ads on html pages and i dont think that is a win/win situation for anyone.

geeze secman its one link site whats you f.... problem???? make an index page or submit to someone else........what do you expect, because you dont like their rules they change it back for you???

Ok time to play devils advocate here.... I think the solution is pretty simple.

A. If you want traffic from LL's that require index.html copy the site and make a new folder...

B. The traffic there isn't that important to you and you mirror to the sites that accept it.

Bottom line, this isn't a penisbot issue it will be going accross the board soon IMHO so if you want the traffic make a site for them and don't do things the lazy way and mirror one site with 20 enter pages... This was the whole concept of mirroring, to make things faster and easier for the submitter. well times change these people worked hard to get their LL's to where they are and have every right to do what they want with them. This biz always changes so you either flow with the change or get washed over by the wave! Simple huh?

|violin|

well that is the ultimate solution to the problem, stu but i thought it might be best to try to negotiate a win/win rather than take my toys and go home. of course i dont expect them to change their rules to suit me, i like thier traffic and dont want to loose it.

is there something wrong with asking?

I mean i doubt i am the only one who is stuck in this catch 22 so if we can come to some kind of clarification then the problem is solved and everyone is happy. if your solution is to not submit to them or to capitulate then thats fantastic. i would rather see a better solution to everyone involved.

im not pissing and moaning here, im trying to see if there is a better way of doing it. if you have a problem with me trying to do that then fine, but im not going to just clam up and go into a win/lose situation becuase you tell me to.

Sec_man Nothing wong ith asking, but you keep going on, they answer you, oke then they answer you again, it wont change the rules, sorry..........

thats my point, kre - its not lazyness that is making me ask. its that if i do what you suggest and make multiple folders with mirrored sites in them then with the rules being different for everyone who wants to be listed i have to make a site that meets the lowest common denominators of all involved and that ultimately means i loose. or i could make a bogus index.html page with bogus recips on it to greenguy and others which i submit to penis bot to make them happy.

i think the whole concept of mulitple index.html pages in multiple site folders is only going to hurt the linklists that require it in the long run because free site builders are going to figure ways around the purpose of doing it. if linklist owners would think about what their rules do to the submitters then i think they would get better quality submissions and their goals will be much easier to acheave. take for instance murry at megapornlinks - he took the time to explain the reasons for a new rule and it made sense so no body had a problem with it. penisbot is really only wanting the same goal that murry did but they have done it in such a way to make it difficult rather than mutually beneficial.

i thought that if i asked and made some suggestions then it might be better - if everyone thinks i am just whining then so be it. but dont think i am going to stop asking questions and trying to work out solutions when i see something i dont think works.

too many in this industry just go along with the crowd imho and i, for one am not going to do that.

i give up, do you thing, and be happy with it..........

Ok first I never said you were whinning the only reason for the smiley at the bottom was the thread was starting to look like a soap opera..

The one point you missed is the main one I was trying to make LL owners have put much effort to get their sites in the "elite" class traffic output wise. (As I'm sure you know owning one) and they can do whatever they feel is right to them and their bottom line. You as a submitter aren't a major force to be able to change rules etc. There are 1000+ newbies to fill the slot in the wings at all times. That was my main point. And with that I'm out.... :)



|rasta|

;) thank you stu - i appriciate the permission |nahnah|

of course i know that kre - and yeah my effort might be doomed to begin with, but should that stop me from trying?

i dunno about everyone else but if i see something that i think will do more harm then good i am going to say something about it rather than just rolling over and thinking i am too miniscule to do something about it.

just cuz nobody else will say the emperor is naked doesnt mean i will too.

at the very least this has become a very intresting thread :D

Heeeeee sec_man dont stick your tonque at me|attention you should be working instead of nagging.........|bananna|

Ah I see the never ending quest not to meet the link list owners rules this is real simple, not even a debate needed either follow them or move on and find another site to submit to :)

okay, i just want to make this clear. i am NOT trying to usurp their rules or tell them that they dont have a right to do whatever they want to do.

i just wanted to ask them what the reason is before i decide to move on or not. they have every right to make their rules whatever they want them to be as i have every right to ask them to reconsider. and you know me better than to assume thats what i am doing mrmarylou.

New rule at Cleo's Links… you must be completely nekkid while submitting or you will be banned.

Please install and turn on your web cam no later then midnight tonight.



|couch|