-: FS Auto Submitter :- Pros and Cons?

[creamxtreme]

After careful consideration, I have decided to create a Free Site Auto Submitter.

The problem I am having is this:

Do I just pick out sites to link to or do I at least ask for volunteers/sponsors to choose to be part of this new software development?

Objective: To develop a FS Auto Submitter and distribute it for use as an integrated part of a website, (CGI script), either for personal use or to attract webmaster members to a webmaster resource membership site.

What are some of your ideas on FS Auto Submitters and if you had the chance to be added to one would you do so?

Generally, each stage/phase of the submission process will allow a webmaster to submit to nine LL's, before having to go to another fill out form to list another index page to yet another nine LL's. So on and so forth til the submitter has exhausted the entire database of LL's to submit too.

Links to the LL's Rules and Recip Buttons will be placed along side their final respective submission button. All fields of each LL's forms will be included as they are on their own sites. Category and subcategory selection, if any at all, will be last due to many variances in the types of categories/subcategories to pick from at each LL.

There are many great Auto Site Submitters out there, and some of you receive submissions from these services. I have attempted to refine this service and am looking for both ideas and participants. So I would love to see you there.

Nick

P.S. PM me if you do not wish to publicly discuss this matter on an open forum.

[Greenguy]

If you auto-submit to me, then I "auto-decline" the submit.

most of us think that if we take the time to review the site, you can take the time to submit it by hand.

[DangerDave]

Auto submit anything to me and say good bye to ever being listed..

DD

[MrMaryLou]

creamxtreme your just full of things to do to piss off LL owners One thread your pro revsharehosting and now its auto submits

[MrMaryLou]

Oh and one more thing is this your domain ? creamxtra.com revsharehosted and not too slick

[Surfn]

Here we go again...long windy posts on the virtues of autosubmitters.

[DangerDave]

Every day.. many of us think about closing our submit pages, making it partners only, or charging for submissions....

Crap like 'auto-submitters' only drive's us further toward these inevitable outcomes..

BS free hosts,... massed produced crap sites with free content,... 1000 BS submissions a day,.. fake recips,.. 400 mirrored entrances...

How much more do you think we are going to take...?!! Will we sit back while the entire model of "free sites" and "sponsors" gets destroyed?!

Think about it!

DD

[MrMaryLou]

DD you are so right whats the damn point ya got webmasters busting the asses making sites all days paying for hosting submitting by hand and now all of the sudden its I am not paying for hosting and hell I am not gonna bother to even submit by hand either

[creamxtreme]

Actually I am not trying to piss off anyone.

Being an LL owner myself, I respect the opinions of other LL owners whether they agree with me or not.

GreenGuy and DangerDave both state that they would not accept submissions from an AS. Doing so would get a person banned with them forever. Would I get pissed off at their position? I don't think so. I respect it!

Now about Revshare Hosting, I personally got nothing against them and if I took up a position supporting them, I think that is my personal right to do so, without criticism from you or anyone else.

As for creamxtra.com this is one of many of my sites, it is not developed fully and is in the works. Despite the fact that I do not push it, it has an Alexa rating of 500,000 up from 4,000,000. I believe the last time I looked a google PR of 3. All this from a site that just sits there.

I've have had many of my sites listed in many great LL's to include the GreenGuys and many other fabulous sites. Some (LL's) I have seen stating clearly, that they will accept Auto Submits, which lead to the idea.

The question isn't whether or not someone is getting pissed off at my ideas, questions or position, it is if you are a link list owner, what do you feel about Auto Submitters. If you would like to stick to that subject I will be glad to recognize your position, other than that, well have a nice night - or day, according to your location in the world.

Greenguy gives a reason for his wanting to see hand submitted sites, DD doesn't and personally, I already know alot of cheaters use them, so I don't need to be told this. The question now goes back to if you are a LL owner, would you consider being a part of a submission software package and would you accept sites from one.

So far two neahs, and no yeahs.

Nick

P.S. Edited: I posted before I seen your repies Surfn and DD coming back in. I take it this happened before Surfn?

DD you are right there are a lot of owners P.O.'d at the onslaught of attacks by autosubmitters and massed produced sites. I questioned the reasoning behind LL owners' accepting only index.html pages recently on another board. After hearing you here I understand this position many LL owners are now taking over doorway pages.

What I get here generally AS's are not a very good idea. I also read here on this board, that the only dumb question is the one that isn't asked. No where did I read that no one can bring up touchie subjects. Sorry!

[MrMaryLou]

Ya know the sad part creamxtra.com was listed at few link sites the dont take revsharehosting So I suppose you wont bother to follow any rules of LL even if they told you no auto submitting or revshare So sad

[creamxtreme]

Originally posted by MrMaryLou
Ya know the sad part creamxtra.com was listed at few link sites the dont take revsharehosting So I suppose you wont bother to follow any rules of LL even if they told you no auto submitting or revshare So sad

I had asked prior to submitting sites from Revshare if LL's would take them. I also submitted it to sites that stated clearly, "I will accept free hosted sites on a per case basis". Others changed their rules after submitting that site.

Which I also incidentally wrote and asked about this, once I noticed that free sites were not allowed. Again, a couple of those sites changed their position, on accepting them. Again, I immediately notified any LL owner who may have had a problem with this site, that it existed.

I do not know any one who is immune to making mistakes. But it is what we do with those mistakes that counts. If anyone had a problem with this site or any other I submitted to them, they got a valid email, they could of wrote me about it.

I think the nicest ones about the inquiry of mine was at Hoes. Then I received a letter from the owner. Which I had no problem accepting their position. Adult list, I believe was one who accepted it. Again, not before I asked though.

Now I did not come to this board to argue with you or anyone else. And I honestly do not need to put up with someone elses inadequacies. So DIG, if you have any other problems, take them up with your psychologist okay - please!

Nick

[MrMaryLou]

Dig this |goodnight |goodnight |goodnight |goodnight Opening mental Rolodex inserting memory ok done

[creamxtreme]

Have a nice night!

I've neglected my little ones too much today.

Nick

[DangerDave]

creamxtreme,

Autosubmitter crap is ALWAYS gonna get a negative response here.. because there is no up-side..

I for one have never used one ever.. and if you have a biz-model that requires you to use one.. then that model is flawed.

There are no "inadequacies" here. !

Just honest hard-working webmasters that live and play by the rules.. we ask no more and we expect no less.

DD

[Jaden]

Okay now these are opinions are coming from a total and complete newbie point of view so bear with me guys

I personally as a webmaster out there building free sites and submitting faithfully would never use an autosubmitter for a couple of reasons. When I first started I got 1 piece of advice that has stuck with me and proven incredibly true.

It was...if I was going to be in this biz for the long haul then respect, credibility and reputation were paramount. I have worked my ass off to learn and get my feet under me, and while I am more than willing to save myself time when I can, I also will not do anything that would put me in a light as being anything but someone who is willing to put back in as much as I am getting out, and having people who have been a long time in this biz who I have nothing but respect for look at me as anything but that. And that philosophy has worked well and paid off more than any time I could possibly save myself by not taking that extra time to hand submit. If they are going to show me and my work the respect to go through everything needed to review my site the very least I can do is respect their work enough to actually go to their site and fill out their form. And truthfully, after I have spent all the time building it, it seems backwards to me to not want to make sure right there and then that my submit went through with no problems, there were no rule changes I needed to be aware of, etc. Also, I have yet to run into a submit form that takes longer than about 30 seconds to fill out, or a list of rules that takes longer than a minute to read. Which seems to me to be very minimal for the returns.

As for paid hosting vs revshare or free I do have to say that having started out with paid hosting was probably one of the best things I could have done. BECAUSE....it made me work harder and want to learn more. After I had built a few sites and my bandwidth expense started to go up, it really made me start looking at what I was doing, and adjusting and trying to refine right away. I can honestly say I don't know if I would have worked as hard with each consecutive site to make it better or jumped in with so many questions to so many people to learn more about what I was doing right and what just really wasn't a good idea, if I wouldn't have felt it in my wallet right away. There were alot of things I can see the importance of figuring out sooner than later now, but if every month I didn't actually have that extra little push in the beginning I can say I probably would have taken it all alot slower and not pushed myself forward as hard as I did. And wouldn't necessarily have made those little tweaks to each site before submitting them if I weren't going to paying for each and every one of them. It made sense to me that every site should be the absolute best I could make it because I was actually going to pay for it whether I made money from it or not, so I better start figuring out how to get it to pay off sooner than later. And it got me into the good habit of taking each day and learning more, and pulling from the resources I plugged into then.

Anyway...just a little newbie's 2 whole spare cents on it all LOL

Jaden

[Surfn]

Jaden

That's the right attitude to make it in this biz for the long haul.

[DrSmut]

BoY!...You just cant help but make friends now can you?

[creamxtreme]

DD this was a question jsut a question nothing more. And MrMaryLou came in talking about pissing people off. The thread now took a turn to another subject. "Pissing people off and making friends".

Yes, I understand about hard working webmasters. I am one myself. No I do not have a Biz-model that uses nor requires an AS. I tried to be as clear as possible about the whole thing, when asking if you "that's anyone" would use auto submitters and if given the right one, participate in a new one.

Unlike many here, there are webmasters who do not mind them. And the only way to find out who they are is to ask. And if asking is a problem and it causes someone to get P.O.'d then what happened to the openness and freindliness of the board. You know questions are not asked to "piss people off".

Jaden you are right in many ways. I agree with you on respecting credibility and reputation. And I fully understand your methodology, especially where you want to design your site to pay off handsomely. But no-matter where you are who your site is housed with, you can spend countless hours designing your site and you want it to bring a return for your efforts, certainly no-one wants this to go down in vain.

DrSmut "freinds" are cool especially if you have them all over the world. But we are here to make contacts. Learn the biz and ultimately come to a point in our lives where we live comfortably, making a living out of this business. But to learn and grow, there must be discussions and even if those subjects are contriversial, they still must be discussed.

I can name at least 10 LL's that accept auto submits, so they are not dead in the water. Unfortunately as DD points out, there is a lot of abuse associated with the use of them and many do not accept them. Each of us have our own opinion, and we are entitled to it.

But you know just cause you do not like a subject, go dig up dirt on someone, then start to personally attack them. This is a falicious argument and only steals away from the heart of the subject.

My dirt suppposedly is CreamXtra.com, which incidentally was accepted by many LL's from what I am told here. When I first started submitting I was not aware of the fact that Revshare was a free host. This site got submitted to several LL's. Once I was aware of it, I made every effort to contact those LL's who it was submitted to.

Now to clarify this, for the sake of argument, hosting at Revshare is paid for by the sponsors. In return for this, "hosting of your website", you agree to forfeit some of your earnings the sponsor would normally pay you directly. I seen nothing wrong with this.

Yet, by all accounts Revshare seems to be a Free Host to many LL owners. Once I was aware of this, again, I made every effort to contact the owners of the LL's to discuss this matter with them.

Some answered many did not. The reason for my contacting them was so that my name and my email address along with this site would not get banned. No one is immune from mistakes and mistakes are made sometimes by misinterpretation, or misunderstandings.

But if you look at this site and some of the work I have done there, you will see I put much effort into it. I never finished it cause I took a different route and began different projects, it is still a possibilty that I may finish it, but for larger LL's I see there is no way that their visitors will benefit from it, SADLY, they will not accept Revshare hosted sites.

Now as for the concept of my AS that I was developing is to attrack submitters with this software. Each of us as LL owners, has a return page, offered up, once a submitter finishes his/her submissions. On this return page, we offer the submitter other LL's to submit to. My idea was to allow those submitters an opportunity to autosubmit to friends sites or to sites who have chosen to be part of the AS package.

In most instances, this return or final page after submission is not accessible through anyone's browser without going through a submission. So it reduces the chance of cheats, using it to abuse anyone's site. Additionally, if placed inside a .htaccess protected folder, no-one can access the script outside of each webmasters own site who would use it.

No website submission form within this AS package would be there without permission of the LL owner themselves. It was designed to benefit LL owners and their submitters alike. Not to be detrimental to anyone's system, by having Kooks get their hands on it and pulverize someones' system with endless submits.

My own LL would be included and I would certainly not want to be bombarded by some of the BS I already receive now, nor would I appreciate an increase of this activity. In fact, in my own personal belief, using it in it's proper perspective, it would reduce the incidence of abuse, many of us witness at the present moment.

I hear many of you and your distaste against AS's, but if there are any who agree with the concept of them, I would like to hear from you also.

Nick

P.S. If you received a submission from me which included the websites, creamxtra and creamx, and believe that Revshare is not for you please, purge your database of these sites. I apologize for my Greenness, when I first started submitting.

If however, you do not mind Revshare Hosted Freesites, them please let me know. I have plenty of material to share with you and your visitors.

[Greenguy]

creamxtreme - don't take what we say to personally - it's just that we deal with stopping auto submitters every day & we're pretty much fed up with them

We then see a thread started on the topic & since most of our hatred it built up in our minds, we tend to relieve ourselves via the board

[Fonz]

Damn, there are some looooonnngggg posts here.

I can understand both sides. The established LL owners don't need AS because they already have enough hand-submissions each day and these AS-submissions are of lower quality/higher cheater rate most of the time.

On the other side... Beginning LL owners who only have 2-3 submissions a day could really use more submissions so joining AS is very attractive because their LL will fill up much faster.

But again.. in the long term it's quality above quantity.

Just my $0.02

[Cleo]

I love auto submits over at my LL since I auto add them to my ban list and never see them again as they just keep on automatically adding my recips to pages. |skull|

[creamxtreme]

Originally posted by Cleo
I love auto submits over at my LL since I auto add them to my ban list and never see them again as they just keep on automatically adding my recips to pages. |skull|

Now that's funny.

But on the serious side I understand your point.

I think Fonz says it best. Larger LL owners who need to reduce the frequency of submits, can be choosey on how they get them. While smaller LL owners would love to be a part of a program to attract quality submitters. I appreciate this input highly Fonz - thanks.

Greenguy, no it really isn't taken personal, I knew there was a problem with my submissions after the Free Host issue was discovered. MrMaryLou's bringing it out into the open helps me to know where I stand. I've been kicked around the block a few times, and I'm still standing. |rasta| I think this will kill me before anything else does.

While larger LL owners are more voiceful here, there are smaller LL owners like myself who would love to participate in an AS program, where each owner shares with other owners their submitters. This script, while vulnerable to cheaters, can only be accessed through submitting to a site. Once banned from a site in particular, the submitter can not access the script again.

That is, until they hit another site in the circuit, but, it will play itself out by notification of a cheater or eventually the cheater burns all his/her bridges. Thereby locking themselves out of the program.

I have a working model of the script online, however, it is not available to anyone unless they request a peek at it, but only under certain circumstances - they have at least 20 active posts here or on another well regarded webmaster BB, they agree not to give out the URL to this script and they may fill out the form but cannot submit to any of the test sites.

Yet, it allows someone to take a look at how it will work. Once placed in an protected folder, only those submitters permitted to access the script can. So it is not something that is a hairbrained idea, but a well thought out maneuver to attract submitters and webmasters, so that there is order and processes to follow and no-one gets screwed in the meantime.

Well, onto other matters, my youngest bambino requires my attention - got to go get him.

Nick

[vangend]

Originally posted by Greenguy
If you auto-submit to me, then I "auto-decline" the submit.

Nice one

Yes I will add all auto submitted sites to my "auto-decline" list.

If a webmaster submit and get declined with the message "You are on the auto-decline list", he might not fell as bad as being black listed.

[creamxtreme]

http://www.standardsubmitter.com/

I found it here:

http://greenguysboard.com/main/welcome.html

Nick

[Surfn]

That's for submitting to TGP's. This board is owned by LL owners.

Why is it that almost every newbie who comes down the pike wants to reinvent the wheel instead of utilizing it?