Bush's Mars Missions

[urb]

So Bush wants to put men on Mars and have a Moonbase.

I guess somebody bought him some Star Trek DVD's for christmas.

[Cleo]

Personally I think it is great. I find it really sad that we made it to the moon and then never returned and built a moon base.

Maybe if the US stops spending so much money on its military we can find some money for exploration of space and research.

On a side note the Mars rover made it off the its platform and is roving.

[urb]

I have some figures (stolen from another board) that illustrate that the USA is cost effective in it's projects.

Earth to Mars

* Distance: Approx. 77 Million kms
* NASA Spirit Cost: Approx. 321 Million
* Launched: 10-06-2003
* Landed: Jan 2004
* Status: Working

Dublin's Luas:

* Length of first two lines: Approx. 25kms
* Luas cost so far: Approx. 675 million
* Construction of Line A, commenced in September 1999.
* Status: Not working

The Dublin Luas is a Tram system btw...

[Cleo]

Well actually I've already been to Mars and most of the other outer planets but it is good to hear that the US is finally moving forward with its space exploration.

[Surfn]

And here I thought Bush was an air-head, I guess he's a vacuum head instead.

[Greenguy]

Val Kilmer proved you could grow plant life on Mars, but those exploding alien creatures will have to be quarantined before I get on the Space Plane to the Mars Vacation Theme Park

[Cleo]

The trick is to wait until they explode and then make a tasty salad mixing 'em in with arugula and goat cheese. The only real thing to remember is to be sure to get back in to a pressurized environment before removing your helmet and enjoying.

[Bill]

The pundits seem to be agreeing that this new space proposal lets bush dump money in the big republican states florida, texas, and california, thus almost guaranteeing a re-election due to the peculiatries of the electoral college system.

Building roads usually doesn't lead to technological advances and the creation of new technological industries, which space research has always lead to in the past. I don't know if it's true, but I've read speculation in the science magazines that what we've already learned in robotics from the mars missions will be worth 30 billion dollars in the next 10 years in commercial robotics, and we all know robotics is poised to be the big tech revolution of the 21st century, as important as the electronic revolution in the 20th century.

Like "no child left behind", I suspect bush's space proposal is a fraud, a political gambit empty of any actual willingness to get the job done, a paper tiger. Basically another way to give tax money to his cronies.

But it's one of the only things he's done which I think we might be able to be proud of, and to profit from.

[DangerDave]

From down here it look like classic "pork-barrelling"...

I would like to see him spend 1 trillion dollars on feeding the worlds starving, the environment, use of non-carbon based fuels, etc etc etc.....

DD

[dubh]

DD. Amen!

[Cleo]

I have complete disdain for Bush, but this could go down as one of the great accomplishments of the 21 century if it actually does take place.

Just my 2¢ on it…

[dareutwo]

DD- you are correct to an extent.
Yes, it may prove to be more money into some big Republican states.
However, we won't be getting there alone. Also standing to get some green backs; Russia, Japan, China, France - basically ANY country that has even remotely useful technology to add to the mix. (doesn't have to be space related as it stands right now)

I would like to see him spend 1 trillion dollars on feeding the worlds starving, the environment, use of non-carbon based fuels, etc etc etc.....

I would love to blame Bush for the environment etc... but the main decisions that brought us to where we are now were mostly made from 1900-1930's.

Major benefits from Space Exploration so far -
GPS, Cell Phones, Computers, MRI's, Velcro, Tang , fuel cells, just to name a few.

This, and it really won't be a budget basher for at least 5 years, simply moving funds already allocated to NASA Away from the Space Shuttle and into this.

Yeah it's probably an election year ploy, but on the other hand, NASA really has to have something else to aim for besides going around and around in the International Space Station.

[Dr Bizzaro]

<holding back on the bush and uranus jokes>
|tomato|

[Bill]

Like Dare says, international co-operation would be an absolute necessity for a big space mission. Every proposal I've read about it says that some type of cooperation among all the big industrial states would be the only way to do it. So, the improved relations and friendships and partnerships ALONE would probably be worth the $200 billion. $200 billion is still only a small part of the annual gross productive economy of the whole planet.

Think about it. Right now the russians are saving our asses in space. We savaged their economy in the cold war, but still, now, we are wary friends, and they have taken on their shoulders the responsibility of keeping the door to space open while we solve a little problem we are having with the aging shuttles.

That is simply _fucking_ amazing.

The best minds in a dozen countries are working together on something incredible. The space station has led to a lot more than most people realize. Yeah, we're learning that running a space station is a lot fucking harder than we thought it would be, but how else could we have possibly learned that without trying?

[docholly]

Originally posted by DangerDave
From down here it look like classic "pork-barrelling"...

I would like to see him spend 1 trillion dollars on feeding the worlds starving, the environment, use of non-carbon based fuels, etc etc etc.....

DD

he could spend 1/10th of that and feed the starving here in the US, starting with Pine Ridge Reservation in SD. or better yet give them the infrastructure to enable them to get jobs themselves.

I love the idea of exploring new worlds, and if he gets re-elected i think he should be the 1st Man on Mars!!!

For our industries sake, we really do need to find a candidate that is more open minded and put our energy into getting him/her (???) elected.

...and just as an FYI, Earthlink just laid of 2000 of its staff due to outsourcing it's inside sales and programming depts to india and the philippines.

[urb]

Maybe he thinks there is oil on Mars.

Maybe he'll develop a new kind of clean fuel in order to get there faster.

There's lots of spin-off techno from projects like this.

[Cleo]

I don't think you can put a price tag on all the benefits coming out of the space program.

Russia, the world, and the US working together in space instead of pointing missiles at each other in nuclear annihilation is priceless.

Speaking of Bush I say we stick a rocket up his ass and see how far we can blast him into space.

[Greenguy]

Remember what happened in Contact? They spent all that money & no one believed Jodi Foster's story!

[Surfn]

Originally posted by Greenguy
Remember what happened in Contact? They spent all that money & no one believed Jodi Foster's story!

That movie has several salient points one of which is government redundancy. They built 2 and the public only knew about 1.

[urb]

Originally posted by Greenguy
Remember what happened in Contact? They spent all that money & no one believed Jodi Foster's story!

Yes but the tape had been running for 30 minutes and she appeared to be only away for a few seconds.

[Greenguy]

Originally posted by Surfn
They built 2 and the public only knew about 1.

Why build one when you can build 2? Plus the 2nd one had to be a bit cheaper since it was just a copy

Originally posted by urb
Yes but the tape had been running for 30 minutes and she appeared to be only away for a few seconds.

Too bad James Woods & the couple of other people that knew that didn't bring it up at her hearing

[urb]

Originally posted by Greenguy
Too bad James Woods & the couple of other people that knew that didn't bring it up at her hearing

Fear of the unknown and fear of being labelled as crazy. Which is half the world's problems in a nutshell.

[DangerDave]

I can see the validity, neccessity and stunning achievement in space travel and exploration...

..but I still believe their must be some balance and some compassion from these goverments that throw around, billions and trillions of dollars..

World co-operation for these missions/projects is an outstanding achievement too...

..but still they build the missle defence system. and now it looks like we are gonna be involved;(

DD

[Bill]

There are many millions of people here in the U.S. that are just as sad and worried and embarrased as the rest of the world that the leadership of our country has been handed over to a group of militaristic christian plutocrats.

There is a lot of culture conflict and culture shock going on in the U.S., and our educational system is collapsing, so there is a huge surplus of stupid people here.

Stupid people frighten easily, and religious people are notoriously violent, and we have a lot of both stupid people and religious people here. And our schools and our respect for learning and thoughtfullness and intelligence has never been in worse shape.

We hope that things will get better here. But, it won't be easy. Our culture shock is causing more and more people to turn to religion and violence for comfort. There's no way to stop something like that quickly.

Space exploration is an antidote to religious bigotry and primitive thinking. It may get us to co-operate, rather than to fear and plan violence. If we give our southern states something scientific to do, it may slow the rush to religious conservatism.

Thoughtful, modern people are not in charge now in the U.S.. We're sorry about that, and we're trying to change it. But there is no simple solution. We dug ourselves into this pile of shit, and it will take years, maybe decades, to get the shit cleaned up.

[Cleo]

Very well put Bill.