Anybody remember this thread?

[susanna]

Am I the only one questioning the "sleep assault" content? I am by far niave to the kinks of this world but kink is not assault. Where is the consentualism? How can it possibly pass the visa test? Wasn't Visa going nuts on stuff like this?

This on the same day that there is a thread/story out there on how Bush plans to attack rape and torture sites with the same tactics that they went after cp.

I find it hard to believe that gg and jim have chosen money over ethics on this one.

[deleuze]

http://www.greenguysboard.com/board/...highlight=rape

or this one

http://www.greenguysboard.com/board/...highlight=rape

?

I wonder if their reception would be different if they skinned the board?

[Linkster]

I remember both of those quite well - its interesting however though to see what would happen if you come out and actually question the justification this time - Im not going to because Ive already heard it and Ive already made my decisions to not promote them.

[Extreme John]

Im sure Airek will be in here shortly to respond. Im curious Linkster your choosing not to promote the entire portfolio of sites because you personally are uncofortable with 1 of the sites out of 7?

[Linkster]

John - no offense meant at all - I'm not "comfortable" with two of the sites - and yes that will make my decision as to whether I promote a sponsor - a third site includes those two as "additional content" and without seeing inside the members area but knowing the standard practices today of most programs - I would imagine those sites are also included on the inside of all of the other sites.

Believe me its not a comfort issue - to me its a justification issue for me to deal with between me and my surfers - while there is one site that I would love to promote and would probably be doing a couple sales a day - the others keep me from adding it to my portfolio.

Ive also already heard a bunch of justifications this morning which some I agree with, some I disagree with and unfortunately the weighting right now is is the disagree column.

The funny part of the whole thing to me was (and the real reason I even responded to this thread) that the justifications used to me this morning were the same ones that the people in these threads posted here were using - and yet the people defending and giving the justifications this morning were the same people yelling BS at these other peoples justifications in the old threads.

[ponyman]

Originally Posted by Linkster

Ive also already heard a bunch of justifications this morning which some I agree with, some I disagree with and unfortunately the weighting right now is is the disagree column.

Did you hear these justifications on a board somewhere? I'd like to read them, too.

[Linkster]

Originally Posted by ponyman

Did you hear these justifications on a board somewhere? I'd like to read them, too.

ponyman - no they were discussions with some other LL owners - not posted anywhere.

John - We've known each other for a long time and I kinda expected that you and I wouldnt have a problem with this

[Extreme John]

Originally Posted by Linkster

John - no offense meant at all - I'm not "comfortable" with two of the sites - and yes that will make my decision as to whether I promote a sponsor - a third site includes those two as "additional content" and without seeing inside the members area but knowing the standard practices today of most programs - I would imagine those sites are also included on the inside of all of the other sites.

Believe me its not a comfort issue - to me its a justification issue for me to deal with between me and my surfers - while there is one site that I would love to promote and would probably be doing a couple sales a day - the others keep me from adding it to my portfolio.

Ive also already heard a bunch of justifications this morning which some I agree with, some I disagree with and unfortunately the weighting right now is is the disagree column.

The funny part of the whole thing to me was (and the real reason I even responded to this thread) that the justifications used to me this morning were the same ones that the people in these threads posted here were using - and yet the people defending and giving the justifications this morning were the same people yelling BS at these other peoples justifications in the old threads.

Oh please understand, I am not offended, Ive always had a strict rule about how I do business or how I view how others do business. Im not here to judge anyone, nor would I ever take any judgments on me to heart, the only person I have to deal with on that level is my wife, children and family, beyond that anything I do follows those rules Business is Business not personal.

I respect your views, and by all means you have a right to do business in whatever fashion you choose, and I respect whatever fashion that might be.

[XPorn]

I'm in the same boat with ya Linkster...

XPorn

Originally Posted by Linkster

John - no offense meant at all - I'm not "comfortable" with two of the sites - and yes that will make my decision as to whether I promote a sponsor - a third site includes those two as "additional content" and without seeing inside the members area but knowing the standard practices today of most programs - I would imagine those sites are also included on the inside of all of the other sites.

Believe me its not a comfort issue - to me its a justification issue for me to deal with between me and my surfers - while there is one site that I would love to promote and would probably be doing a couple sales a day - the others keep me from adding it to my portfolio.

Ive also already heard a bunch of justifications this morning which some I agree with, some I disagree with and unfortunately the weighting right now is is the disagree column.

The funny part of the whole thing to me was (and the real reason I even responded to this thread) that the justifications used to me this morning were the same ones that the people in these threads posted here were using - and yet the people defending and giving the justifications this morning were the same people yelling BS at these other peoples justifications in the old threads.

[MrYum]

Originally Posted by Linkster

John - no offense meant at all - I'm not "comfortable" with two of the sites - and yes that will make my decision as to whether I promote a sponsor - a third site includes those two as "additional content" and without seeing inside the members area but knowing the standard practices today of most programs - I would imagine those sites are also included on the inside of all of the other sites.

Believe me its not a comfort issue - to me its a justification issue for me to deal with between me and my surfers - while there is one site that I would love to promote and would probably be doing a couple sales a day - the others keep me from adding it to my portfolio.

Ive also already heard a bunch of justifications this morning which some I agree with, some I disagree with and unfortunately the weighting right now is is the disagree column.

The funny part of the whole thing to me was (and the real reason I even responded to this thread) that the justifications used to me this morning were the same ones that the people in these threads posted here were using - and yet the people defending and giving the justifications this morning were the same people yelling BS at these other peoples justifications in the old threads.

Apparently, this boat has at least 3 oarsman.

A couple of the sites look pretty good...a couple I wouldn't touch. Certainly not the first sponsor to push the edge too far...imo. No doubt, not the last either

Certainly doesn't do us any good as an industry when we portray the women as little more than cum receptacles.

[SirMoby]

I never liked the forced sites, drunk sites, tricked sites, skat and I don't like sex with animals. I know all that makes good money but I don’t like it and I don’t promote it. However, there are a lot of people that probably think I’m a sick bastard for profiting on naked women that obviously enjoy being naked for money.

For me to criticize the choice of others would be a bit hypocritical so I figure to each his own. There’s countless webmasters so no one needs me to make a buck and there’s also countless sponsors. I have a great deal of respect for GG, Jim and Extreme John and there’s nothing about Rage Cash that’s going to affect that.

[susanna]

I believe that there is way too many webmasters that blindly follow what trusted people like gg and jim do. They make it their business to have people following them and trusting their judgement. Dont fool yourselves, this board doesnt exist for the mindless posts of everyone that wants to say their morning hello's.

This board exists as a forum that attracts many people, most of which come here to hear industry news, to hear what others are up too and to learn from those trusted old timers (and at times newcomers).

When gg a jim condone something I feel is wrong I speak to them about it. Of course they do as they please but they are gracious enough to let me post to the contrary in the hopes that most of you out there will atleast think about what you are about to get yourself into. When I say gg and jim sold out for money, I also mean those of you out there marketing that site are also throwing ethics aside for money.

I always end posts like these (getting really tired of having to post about rape sites) with the question.....how would you like it if your wife/girlfriend/lover/sister/mother was fucked in her sleep because some guy thought that it was her fantasy?

Give me a break... there is only one type of person with that fantasy... the type is the person who likes NON-consentual sex.

When someone profits from a non-consentual rape site, even if its disguised as a reality fantasy site, I do not approve and I speak out.

You do what your own conscience says you should do.

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by susanna

When I say gg and jim sold out for money, I also mean those of you out there marketing that site are also throwing ethics aside for money.

It always amazes me when people use the words "ethics" since it means so many different things. Is promoting a Couples Sex site where most of the models are NOT couples and they'll fuck any one for money ethical?

Does the same statement apply to you site as well?

Keep in mind I will not promote Rage Cash in any way but I see no reason to judge others for doing so. Aren't we all living in glass houses?

[susanna]

Originally Posted by SirMoby

It always amazes me when people use the words "ethics" since it means so many different things. Is promoting a Couples Sex site where most of the models are NOT couples and they'll fuck any one for money ethical?

Does the same statement apply to you site as well?

Keep in mind I will not promote Rage Cash in any way but I see no reason to judge others for doing so. Aren't we all living in glass houses?

The reason to judge others for doing so is that its illegal. Do you promote rape sites? do you promote cp sites? all the same thing.

Is there any proof that the couples on my couples sex site are not couples? how do you know by looking at them that they are not? With regard to turning that statement around to the sleeping rape site, can you say the same thing?

My couples sex site is not hurting the industry anymore then the fake lesbian sites or the huge insertion or anal fuck sites....all done for money to apease someone elses kink. I draw the line at appeasing rapists kink.

Its against the law for good reason.


Whats next? reality porn that says its a great kink to fuck unsuspecting mentally retared people? There is a line, there has to be a line and its drawn BEFORE RAPE AND BEFORE CHILDREN OR INFIRM ADULTS. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out.

I am Canadian...the land of not judging anyone of anything but Canadians are not stupid...

[sue-fl]

Originally Posted by susanna

I believe that there is way too many webmasters that blindly follow what trusted people like gg and jim do. They make it their business to have people following them and trusting their judgement. Dont fool yourselves, this board doesnt exist for the mindless posts of everyone that wants to say their morning hello's.

I take offense to that statement! I have no friends or family that do what I do. To have a place to come and talk to other people in the porn business in great to me. Do I do every thing gg&jim suggest on the board? I say fuck you for even implying I would, I do have a brain and know how to use it.

Of course this board is here to make money!! Nothing wrong with that. People do take the time here to help and offer advice, they care about things going on in others lives. So money is NOT the only reason this board is so successful.

As far as comparing this new site with the old thread, that is wrong. No where on this site does it mention any one being drugged or passed out drunk. It's females that have fallen asleep. Think about that for a minute. I have gone to bed damn tired many a nights. There is no way in hell my husband could get me totally aroused and have sex with me without me waking up!!! This site does not imply that any girl wakes up and freaks out and says no and he continues to fuck her. Excuse me if I offend anyone by saying what I'm about to say. There has been hundreds of times in my 28 years of marriage that I have been woken to his tongue or cock in various places. Rape?? Damn I say wake me up like that anytime you want to!!

No drugs, no passed out drunks, no one waking up terrified and fighting off an assault. No issue as far as I'm concerned!!

[Useless]

Maybe it's my lack of beauty sleep, but I'm just now seeing the issue here. It appears that vast majority of use agree that Sleep Assault is a rape site. The text quotes from the site itself are pretty damning, there's no denying that. So the main argument must be the lack of reaction or criticism towards its owners. Some of you would like to see a complete outcry against Rage Cash for conceiving the site in the first place, perhaps a total ban of their program. I think you realize that that just isn't going to happen. Even if they were'nt a board sponsor, I doubt that everyone would be going nuts right now.

If it was a site that was peddling true assault pics instead of staged bullshit, yes - we would be screaming foul and contacting the police and tearing the program apart. But it's not. It's fake. It's twisted, but it's fake. I think there are some who don't perceive it as rape because the girls aren't struggling against it, but I disagree. Again, the site's own text says it all. Like I've said, I won't promote anything or accept listings to anything like that.

I more than understand why people would be pissed and outraged. I really do. The first time I saw it I too referred to it as a rape site. I showed it to my wife and she agreed, though she appeared to think the whole premise was cheesey.

I truly hope that the site owners reconsider the site now that they see the reactions to it, but if I abandoned every program that did things that nauseate me, I'd been broke a long time ago.

[babymaker]

i don't believe in censorship or judging other's too much lol( if i hate a mutherfucker i hate them lol) but i too had a problem with that site when i saw the board change and checked it out just casually, i went again after all the controversy and watched the first free sample clip??? isin't that considered rape and illegal in most if not all states?? an unconcious girl being fucked against her will??? i understand it's fantasy but i can't promote that, i understand also that what i promote creampie can be considered by some to be immororal, but it is consensual, i don't want to be hated or blacklisted and i am not judging anyone, but to me it seemed not approriate. so while it seems as if we are voting here in a way, i put my vote for no, i am sorry, not like anyone needs my traffic but the line has to be drawn somewhere and while we are under extreme media scrutinty(while that should not be the reason!) it would seem this is an even worse time for a site such as this, not that i would believe that there ever would be one.

[deleuze]

A few points:

1) The site in question is not illegal;
2) Many if not the majority of people who get off on rape fantasies are women;
3) The site in question unlike some others that have been discussed here before does a very poor job at appealing to those with rape fantasies as there is no confrontation, no struggle, and no realized violation. The only people who I can see it appealing to are misogynists with no active fantasy life.
4) Still nobody has answered the question why a person or company promoting something controversial will be either blindly ostracized or accepted into the community based on what the gods deem worthy. I came here for some lunch-time drama yesterday expecting everyone to tell this newest rage to fuck off and putting their sites on an elite blacklist. This was based on how I've seen you devour other people with similar sites. Insitead I discover people here have just a short of memory as all the idiots at other boards they love to disparage. Boring.

[Greenguy]

Originally Posted by deleuze

A few points:

1) The site in question is not illegal;...

I was gonna try a different angle, but I just realized something. You don't have a problem with Rage Cash, do you?

You're problem is with Jim & me, correct?

[deleuze]

Originally Posted by Greenguy

You're problem is with Jim & me, correct?

Not necessarily Jim & you but the way the board in general in the past has treated people affiliated with these types of sites. I really fail to see the difference between what RageCash is offering and other rape sites that have been around forever. The adult community and this board in particular has always gone out of their way to place the owners of these sites in the same class as pedophiles and now RageCash comes along and everyone is backing off saying well so long as it's legal to each his own . . . I'm not here to judge.

[Greenguy]

deluze - so the entire argument that they wake up & enjoy the sex OR that it's a dream the girl is having is not good enough for you?

[Robbo]

I was`nt going to post when I saw this thread start but I guess I will. I was surprised when I saw the sites in question. Don`t like it and won`t promote it. But I won`t judge either. We have too much of that in this country at this time. Life imitates art and that would be some imitation we could do without. Then you could say the sites are art imitating life. But then they take that argument for cp too. I guess I`m just chiming in on the verbal poll.

[Agent]

Debating is good but the hostility is creeping in.

I don't care for the three or four threads dedicated to it though. I've already made my decision on the issue.

[MrYum]

Originally Posted by ADK

Debating is good but the hostility is creeping in.

I don't care for the three or four threads dedicated to it though. I've already made my decision on the issue.

Exactly

We all have our own views and are hopefully intelligent to make our own decisions.

Beyond that...it's

[susanna]

Originally Posted by MrYum

Exactly

We all have our own views and are hopefully intelligent to make our own decisions.

Beyond that...it's

I think I will go make another thread...let me see....what will I call it...

hmmm how about "multiple threads get more complaints then rape site"?

Official note...those of you that have already made up your mind, firm, no one is going to change it with views you may not have thought of....its not necessary to post that as we understand that to be a given.

Those that are still debating it and thinking about it, feel free to post something constructive.