Oldschool reinvented noob got a few questions!

[juggernaut]

Originally Posted by JD

Hi all, I like this board, which brings me to post here

I was a webmaster back in 99, so stuffed around with free sites a bit and then into avs for years and it died a horrible death (avs), and so did my bank account, oh well |confused|
Then I did galleries for a while (yukk), hated them, lots of work for little result imho. So three weeks ago I've gone back to my free site stuff, where I really started, back when there was only 6 or so big sponsors around . Now I see theres zillions and zillions of them.

My questions based on the new breed of free site builders follows:

1. Can you still make a living creating free sites these days? Probably a dumb ass question considering all the people on here that make them, unless you all do it part time )

2.Are there any sponsors that basically you just won't get listed with (even if you have 2 day old content from them)? For example, I've been using deecash and I like them, dont seem to have a problem with getting listed, BUT if I used nasty dollars with new content would I still get listed on the major sites? I guess I'm looking for a list of a few sponsors that just wont be accepted at the larger link lists, if thats the case. I imagine its a bit different than the gallery people though, there they are very strict with you having hte same sponsors they have on their sites.

3. I am building one or two free sites each day and submitting them to 20 or so link lists. I know its a difficult question to answer, but how long (ball park figure) is it taking you guys to see lets say a sale a day after submitting every day? I know thats a small ammount of income but I realise things take a long time, like Xallow (sp?), after 3 weeks of solid work, I havent seen much in sales or traffic, but I do realise, like the tgp game(only way its like it), it does take time to get the traffic coming in and getting listed (at ll's and se's). So do you think after 3 months of submitting daily I might see a couple sales a day from the work? (I know its a tough question, depends of multiple factores)

4. Vids or pics these days? I've tried some free movie sites, and pic sites as well, and for some reason, I'm not seeing as much traffic to the movie sites. What are you experienced builders finding? Pics or movies, or a mixture of the two (not on same site, thats a no no I hear?

5. Whats bandwidth like these days making and submitting 1 or 2 sites a day to all the large sites? Is it pretty small? I am used to large BW on the galleries in the past, just wondering if a 10mb server is required in the long run of free site building if you are using movies a lot?

6. Htaccess - do u guys still use it? Do u use something to protect movies as well?

Thanks guys, sorry for all the questions, I've been reading lots on here, and found some good posts, now its just a matter of getting past the pain barrier of building until I can see some results for the hard work!
I know there wont be the bullshit that you get at gfy with everyone saying they are making millions at this stuff )

JD
(justin)

I can only help you answer a couple of these and I'm sure others will follow.

1) I think you can still make a living with FS but you have to be agressive. It's like anything else, flood the market and sales should come in as long as you keep up with it.

2) I stick with the sponsers GG has listed here and if I don't get listed with their stuff then I move on and just keep submitting. Set it can forget it. I dont dwell much on why they did not accept it, maybe I should as I guess I could get BL if I keep submitting stuff they don't want but I read the rules and submitting something someone does not like cause it's over used IMO should not get you BL. Cheating and not reading the rules will get your BL.

3) Put up some examples and others will tell you whats wrong. Depending on the amount of traffic I would think in 3 months you should have seen 1 or 2. But like you said others factors here so put up some examples and let the more seasoned pros give better advice on that.

4) I'll let a more seasoned pro work this. I don't deal with vids to much.

5) I would not worry about it till you get an overage bill. There are enough companies out there that you can work with to deal with this old nightmare. I would not buy a server either, not at this time. If you set the site up right and small then you should not really have a problem with page load times, I would think you need a shitload in order to kill your BW. Besides if you are going to go with movies I would let the sponser host that stuff.

6) Yes it's still used and used very often. It's your savor in most cases for blocking crap. And as far as blocking movies I have read two opinons. One says you can do it and one says you can't. The one that said you can't made much more technical sence to me and when I tried it I could not get it to work. I honestly believe you can't protect movies with that file. I think you need software or something. But remember opinons are like assholes. If someone here does have it working I'm sure others here would love to know how.

[JD]

Thanks for the post juggernaut.

Yes agressive, meaning work your ass off and make multiple sites a day instead of just chilling after making one and submitting it ).


Which sponsors that GG has listed, do you mean on his stats page, or is there a list of approved sponsors I cant see?

Hopefuly you mean after 3 months, 1 or 2 sales a DAY, not TOTAL, |shocking| Total would suck! I hate myself for not submitting a site a day for the last 5 years, $$$ down the toilet.

"if you are going to go with movies I would let the sponser host that stuff." Well that gos againsts some LL rules. everything sposed to be on your own domain, but no worries, will limit the movies )

Funny what you said about HT, the same thing was occuring years ago when I did this, some say the movie thing works, others no. But I will set up HT on my pic pages anyhow )

thanks again for your comments )
JD

Originally Posted by juggernaut

I can only help you answer a couple of these and I'm sure others will follow.

1) I think you can still make a living with FS but you have to be agressive. It's like anything else, flood the market and sales should come in as long as you keep up with it.

2) I stick with the sponsers GG has listed here and if I don't get listed with their stuff then I move on and just keep submitting. Set it can forget it. I dont dwell much on why they did not accept it, maybe I should as I guess I could get BL if I keep submitting stuff they don't want but I read the rules and submitting something someone does not like cause it's over used IMO should not get you BL. Cheating and not reading the rules will get your BL.

3) Put up some examples and others will tell you whats wrong. Depending on the amount of traffic I would think in 3 months you should have seen 1 or 2. But like you said others factors here so put up some examples and let the more seasoned pros give better advice on that.

4) I'll let a more seasoned pro work this. I don't deal with vids to much.

5) I would not worry about it till you get an overage bill. There are enough companies out there that you can work with to deal with this old nightmare. I would not buy a server either, not at this time. If you set the site up right and small then you should not really have a problem with page load times, I would think you need a shitload in order to kill your BW. Besides if you are going to go with movies I would let the sponser host that stuff.

6) Yes it's still used and used very often. It's your savor in most cases for blocking crap. And as far as blocking movies I have read two opinons. One says you can do it and one says you can't. The one that said you can't made much more technical sence to me and when I tried it I could not get it to work. I honestly believe you can't protect movies with that file. I think you need software or something. But remember opinons are like assholes. If someone here does have it working I'm sure others here would love to know how.

[SheepGuy]

What?! AVS's are dead ?!!
How come I'm still making most of my income from them?
Did I miss something?

[JD]

Originally Posted by SheepGuy

What?! AVS's are dead ?!!
How come I'm still making most of my income from them?
Did I miss something?

Yes, I should have said "died a horrible death for me"
What ones are working for you these days SG (ones that are open to public that is!)
Is there much benefit in modifying all the free sites I'm making and submitting to avs these days?
thanks
JD

[SheepGuy]

Originally Posted by JD

Yes, I should have said "died a horrible death for me"
What ones are working for you these days SG (ones that are open to public that is!)
Is there much benefit in modifying all the free sites I'm making and submitting to avs these days?
thanks
JD

I do the best with ProAdult Quantum, but still do OK with Cyberage, and a bit with Sexkey and some of the smaller ones. What I like about AVS's is that you get recurring income on the premium sites and when you advertise on the inside pages you know that every surfer has a credit card, and has used it for porn. You can't get better quality traffic than that and I can use iframes to sell vidcams without any linklist owner refusing me for it (as long as it's inside).
Actually I make more from cams than I do most AVS's, but I don't do free sites anymore because I can't advertise them properly there.
There is still good money to be made on premium sites with an original look-feel to them. Since I've started accepting free sites on my LL I find they all look pretty much the same, but for that matter so do most paysites.
In a lot of ways I think creativity is being choked out of this biz, everybody knows what a free site should look like, everybody knows what a paysite should look like, and the results are predictable.
At least with an AVS I know I need a certain amount of content, more than with a free site, but I'm not chained to any sponsor, I can design the way I like, and as long as the surfer gets good value everyone's happy

[JD]

|goodidea Thanks for your input SG!

I bought my home with views on acres with avs recurring income!!!
Unfortunately, as fate would have it, I have to sell it for lack of ongoing funds, oh well, such is life

I used to follow your thinking with the qualified traffic etc. Over the years though I found it increasingly common for avs's to change rules/de-list sites, and millions more webmasters appearing on the links list and hence I saw a huge downturn in traffic and income.

Do you think its worth the time converting my free sites to avs, and will the ones you mention accept sponsor content? (I think cyberage dont). I have about 400 premium sites that arent on any domain any more, they were adult check ones from years gone past, and also about 4000 avs regulars. Dont know if its worth it with the old content submitting them or not |badidea| probably not.

I was thinking of doing some celeb avs sites and upselling to sex key site where I would have the premium one, I see others still doing this. Dont know though, always a risk with celebs, but if its just tabloid pics or whatever I spose it would be safer???

"creativity is being choked out of this biz, everybody knows what a free site should look like, everybody knows what a paysite should look like, and the results are predictable."

Yeh, well damn, free sites are pretty much exactly the same as they were in 99, cept for a couple more strict rules, not complaining though as they are nice and easy to make, and are just a pathway through to the paysite. I havent seen any originality really with porn since the reality craze which is still strong.
thanks again

JD

Originally Posted by SheepGuy

I do the best with ProAdult Quantum, but still do OK with Cyberage, and a bit with Sexkey and some of the smaller ones. What I like about AVS's is that you get recurring income on the premium sites and when you advertise on the inside pages you know that every surfer has a credit card, and has used it for porn. You can't get better quality traffic than that and I can use iframes to sell vidcams without any linklist owner refusing me for it (as long as it's inside).
Actually I make more from cams than I do most AVS's, but I don't do free sites anymore because I can't advertise them properly there.
There is still good money to be made on premium sites with an original look-feel to them. Since I've started accepting free sites on my LL I find they all look pretty much the same, but for that matter so do most paysites.
In a lot of ways I think creativity is being choked out of this biz, everybody knows what a free site should look like, everybody knows what a paysite should look like, and the results are predictable.
At least with an AVS I know I need a certain amount of content, more than with a free site, but I'm not chained to any sponsor, I can design the way I like, and as long as the surfer gets good value everyone's happy

[SheepGuy]

Hey JD,
Yup, the AVS's did fuck themselves out of a lot of long term business for percieved short term gain, some of them still are. If Netverifier was to pay me for all of the rebills they still collect on sites that were once good enough to qualify as Elite I'd be a rich man. But they changed the rules, downgraded the sites, and took my rebills, justifying it by having higher standards now. Pissed me off enough that I moved them. I'm still screwed for all of the rebills, but they're screwed as well because if I'm not making money with them, they're not making money with me. Ditto for Adult Check, who screwed thousands of wm's out of millions of dollars in rebills. Luckily for me I didn't have much with AC so I got out fairly painlessly.

I'm not saying AVS is the only way to go, never put all of your eggs in one basket, but if I was sitting on 400 premium AVS sites that weren't doing anything I'd split them up between ProAdult Quantum and CyberAge Platinum. The 4000 feeder sites I'd likely have half as AVS feeders, half as free sites

And I wouldn't worry about the age of the content so much, if you were buying content in the late 90's it's so old it may as well be new and I can't see any AVS turning you down for it. I've got about $100K in content I bought back then and no AVS has rejected it becouse it's old. It will take me years to go through all of it.
The thing is, so many people who were very good at the AVS game got out of it when a couple of companies screwed them, and now the conventional wisdom is that it's dead, so newbies go right into free sites because they think that's the way it is.
I'm pretty sure that's one of the reasons my AVS income is slowly and steadily rising, and why I still don't need a day job
There's not as much competition there anymore.

Celebs I still stay away from, used to do ok with them but dropped them when the legal shit started and haven't missed them. Maybe it's different now, but I don't even know who's famous anymore

If you want to shoot the shit a bit my email is on the page my sig leads to. I think I remember you from the NV board where I used a different nick.