Found domain name in blacklist :(

[Yahook]

Lots of linklist owners who ban hostings will not write in this thread - I think they are afraid of attention of good webmasters to their linklists. Sure it's more profitable do not write at all.

And I respect very much the linklist owners who write in this thread and say the truth.

[Yahook]

Cos the "Digging Your Own Hole Award" has to go to Scooter and Sundiver!

Natalie, I know Scooter, he is linklist owner too and his linklist is better than a linklist of Surfn for SE traffic for example.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Natalie, I know Scooter, he is linklist owner too and his linklist is better than a linklist of Surfn for SE traffic for example.

If you believe everything that Alexa tells you, or some other "measurement" site tools, you (and others reading this thread) might be tempted to believe that. But the truth is so far removed from what those public stats show that those in the know will be laughing long and hard at this comparison.

[Yahook]

If you believe everything that Alexa tells you, or some other "measurement" site tools, you (and others reading this thread) might be tempted to believe that. But the truth is so far removed from what those public stats show that those in the know will be laughing long and hard at this comparison.

Simon, Alexa will not show mw if you send lots of CJ or other traffic like this to your domain. But I can compare Google PageRank and Google Backward Links - I think it's enaugh to compare site for SE traffic.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Simon, Alexa will not show mw if you send lots of CJ or other traffic like this to your domain. But I can compare Google PageRank and Google Backward Links - I think it's enaugh to compare site for SE traffic.

I know that's what many here think, no matter how many times others post about ignoring PageRank and how Google's backlinks don't tell you the real story. So I'm just mentioning again that to get the real story sometimes requires going way beyond those "tools"... and often means you also need to know all of the domains involved (and the people who own them).

Also, since very few outside the tech world install the Alexa toolbar, quoting their stats for the adult market is almost always pretty far off the mark.

But use whatever is comfortable for you. Personally I base my decisions on other data.

[Yahook]

Mr. Blue, very good answer

But linklist poster don't know which host is not banned because LL owners hide this list.

[Mr. Blue]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Mr. Blue, very good answer

But linklist poster don't know which host is not banned because LL owners hide this list.

You can understand why they hide the list? The LL owner isn't the bad guy in this situation, it's the cheaters who are abusing the system. To prevent cheaters, you take steps, you have to keep some of these steps hidden. It's like installing a safe and then giving out the combination...no one would do that

Just post a question on this board, "Can anyone recommend a hosting company"...people will gladly give you a list of companies, all reputable, and you can start from there

[Yahook]

Simon, I know how to check site for SE, there are lots of other ways instead of PageRank and Link Popularity. For example there is penalty for you in Yahoo:

http://siteexplorer.search.yahoo.com...m&bwm=p&bwms=p

P.S. Sorry that I'm talking about your domain, but you decided to continue it.

[Linkster]

yahook - first off - thats not his domain Second - google has some real nice tools if you really want to see backlinks - besides the link: command which is purposely limited by Google - however if you change out the : for a | then you will see what Google really has for a site.

As far as hosts and banning - I think that most people around here know which hosts they are - and there are loads of threads where even the owners of the hosts have come in and talked about it - so a real quick search here would give you a pretty good list
As far as recips and whether a host is banned - I (and Im sure you do as well at hqpornlinks) get a huge amount of submissions every day - and a good percentage of them are non-partner or crappy sites or known cheaters

heck youve even got a list of them over on your board - and Im sure youre not sitting there worrying about those poor cheaters that you decline and their recips

[Yahook]

I don't want to say your linklist is bad, but your linklist is not good yet to get lots of SE traffic. And any backward link will help, even from "banned" hosting company and you will get lots of them with your policy, because you hide real rules. I just wanted to say from the first my post in this thread that this is not honest. But sure I'm not a god to ooint out how to do your business.

[swedguy]

So what you want is that everybody should have their WHOLE (email, IP's, domain, ...) blacklist fully public?

[Yahook]

Linkster the query "domain.com" will show you all backward links...

[Linkster]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Linkster the query "domain.com" will show you all backward links...

Yahook - here's my first free tip on SEO - that will not show you the backlinks - it will show you everyone that has those words on their page - not linking to you!
Normally I would charge for that kind of advice but since youre a regular poster here - its free I dont know who misled you to think that query would show backlinks - but it will NOT!

sundiver - I dont know where you are getting your information but I can guarantee you that every link list owner I know of - which is a little over 100 of the top link lists - has a host ban list - and so does just about every large TGP out there - and we do occasionally talk about it with each other. It would be stupid for us to not have a ban list - especially when in the past when we didnt look at hosts - we were spending 5-6 hours a day cleaning up sites that cheaters had submitted - and guess what - they all came from the same hosts
As far as the boards that were plotting how to get around the LL rules - I personally read a few of them - after translating of course and I can vouch for what Alex posted - and you would be amazed at some things I learned from their posts.
I can tell you that one host went so far as to post here saying they were cleaning up the cheaters - then went and tried to redirect all of the nameservers to different hosting companies - so Alex knows what he is talking about

[sundiver]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Sundiver, about a year ago, a discussion here lead to the revealing of a single host name that was banned. Within hours, certain webmaster chat boards were filled with ways to get around the ban, how to set up other name servers, the host tried to contract out boxes on another host to move people, etc. It wasn't to stop the reasons that they would have been banned for, but instead to help the exact set of cheaters that were banned to work their way around the blocks. They were not going to make their sites better, remove the toolbar downloaders, the geo redirections, or re-install the images that 404ed to console hell, but they were sure going to try to trick us into listing their shit sites again.

Originally Posted by Linkster

As far as the boards that were plotting how to get around the LL rules - I personally read a few of them - after translating of course and I can vouch for what Alex posted - and you would be amazed at some things I learned from their posts.
I can tell you that one host went so far as to post here saying they were cleaning up the cheaters - then went and tried to redirect all of the nameservers to different hosting companies - so Alex knows what he is talking about

I know what I'm talking about too, because I'm pretty sure I know what boards you're talking about. I remember those topics on GG&J and on those boards... btw, I guess I have even more clear idea about topics on those boards as far as I don't need a translation to read them =)
as I remeber that posts they were made by (and for) honest webmasters which were concerned about banning their hosting. as for cheaters all of them know all the easy technologies you're talking about. I wonder that you found something new for you there.
moving to another hosting is not such a good idea for many of Russian webmasters as far as not all of us has credit cards to pay for a us/eu hosting. Russian hosting providers offer more convinient payment ways for Russian webmasters. so whatever you think about it, not everybody who wanted to change their nameservers, ips, etc are cheaters. not all of them or even non of them wanted to redirect your traffic, put consoles on their sites, and so on.
I do not protect those hosting providers and probably you had more than valid grounds to ban them, I just wanna explain you the situation as it is seen from other side.

Originally Posted by Linkster

I dont know where you are getting your information but I can guarantee you that every link list owner I know of - which is a little over 100 of the top link lists - has a host ban list - and so does just about every large TGP out there - and we do occasionally talk about it with each other. It would be stupid for us to not have a ban list - especially when in the past when we didnt look at hosts - we were spending 5-6 hours a day cleaning up sites that cheaters had submitted - and guess what - they all came from the same hosts

maybe they have such lists, but maybe they also use some more flexible approach to this, because I know a lot of webmasters who use 3fn, hqhost , etc and get listed on most big link lists.

[Yahook]

Yahook - here's my first free tip on SEO - that will not show you the backlinks - it will show you everyone that has those words on their page - not linking to you!

Thanks Linkster, I know how to check backward links "link:domain.com", but if you just use "domain.com" that search will also include backward links and it's not limited.

[Linkster]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Thanks Linkster, I know how to check backward links "link:domain.com", but if you just use "domain.com" that search will also include backward links and it's not limited.

I think you missed my point - I totally agree that the link:domain.com is limited on purpose by Google - but if you just use the domain name - yes you will get all backlinks but you will also get everyone that has just the name on their page without a backlink
Thats why I suggested using link|domain.com - that will just show all of Googles backlinks without the clutter of the sites that arent actually linking to you

[Yahook]

So what you want is that everybody should have their WHOLE (email, IP's, domain, ...) blacklist fully public?

No, I'm talking only for ban of hosting company.

[swedguy]

Originally Posted by Yahook

No, I'm talking only for ban of hosting company.

Since you think it's unfair to people that use a specific hosting company that they don't know they are banned.
Isn't it unfair that people who has a banned email, domain, IP or something else that they don't know about it?

[Yahook]

Since you think it's unfair to people that use a specific hosting company that they don't know they are banned.
Isn't it unfair that people who has a banned email, domain, IP or something else that they don't know about it?

If you ban email, domain - you ban concrate cheater. But if you ban hosting company - you ban all webmasters from this host. Do you see the difference?

[swedguy]

Originally Posted by Yahook

If you ban email, domain - you ban concrate cheater. But if you ban hosting company - you ban all webmasters from this host. Do you see the difference?

Not necessarily.
If an IP is banned, someone else might use it too.

That's not really fair to the other people who use the same IP?

[Simon]

Hi Yahook... yes, as Alex pointed out, that's not my domain.
I just happen to know some of the link list owners here, and am lucky enough to have access to traffic numbers that aren't as easy to find.

Now... again not just addressing this to Yahook... the real point, to me anyway, is that we seem to be discussing changing something that is in place to protect many of the most reputable link list owners. Those arguing for changes are certainly outing themselves in ways that will not help their future ability to trade 'valuable' links and grow their businesses.

This thread should have turned into a "which hosting companies can I use with all confidence?" discussion, but instead it's become a "this isn't fair" (and to whom) discussion. It's been said more than once in this thread that it's not about fair, it's about playing by the rules or not playing with the guys (and girls) who make the rules.

Interesting to me that some people don't seem to get that.

Simon

[Surfn]

Originally Posted by Simon

Hi Yahook... yes, as Alex pointed out, that's not my domain.
I just happen to know some of the link list owners here, and am lucky enough to have access to traffic numbers that aren't as easy to find.

Now... again not just addressing this to Yahook... the real point, to me anyway, is that we seem to be discussing changing something that is in place to protect many of the most reputable link list owners. Those arguing for changes are certainly outing themselves in ways that will not help their future ability to trade 'valuable' links and grow their businesses.

This thread should have turned into a "which hosting companies can I use with all confidence?" discussion, but instead it's become a "this isn't fair" (and to whom) discussion. It's been said more than once in this thread that it's not about fair, it's about playing by the rules or not playing with the guys (and girls) who make the rules.

Interesting to me that some people don't seem to get that.

Simon

Indeed! Honest hard working webmasters that want to make the most money they can and do follow the rules.

[sundiver]

Originally Posted by Simon

it's about playing by the rules or not playing with the guys (and girls) who make the rules.
Simon

are you a poster? I guess you're not
most link list owners do not have such kind of a rule. I mean most link lists accept freesites from banned hosts. if it were a common rule there wouldn't be such kind of discussion.
the part I fully agree with you is that continuing this thread further won't take us anywhere.

[Yahook]

Big linklist owners can close their submit pages and open an partner account system. They will protect their pages from cheaters and everything will be honest. And hosting companies will not be bannes. That's my point of view.

[swedguy]

Originally Posted by Yahook

Big linklist owners can close their submit pages and open an partner account system. They will protect their pages from cheaters and everything will be honest. And hosting companies will not be bannes. That's my point of view.

Now you posted your POV. Why don't you run your LL that way and let other people run their LL the way they want it?

Time to move on.