Katrina aftermath - what the fuck???

[Linkster]

furry girl
http://www.aspca.org/site/PageServer...cane_volunteer
although no one is gonna allow someone to enter the city to rescue animals without training right now - there are plenty of volunteer jobs available in the area - someone needs to care for these animals as they are brought in and for someone that hasnt been trained in the handling of possible rabid, contaminated animals, it would be suicide to try the rescue phase - but the shelters are begging for volunteers to take care of the animals

[furrygirl]

Thanks for the link, I've already emailed every animal group in the area, although HSUS and the ASPCA seem to be the only ones at the timewho are being allowed into disafter areas. No one's gotten back to me yet, and as far as I can tell from message boards, there simply are no openings for non-pros in animal or human aid.

If I lived down there, I'd be happy to open my yard to a bunch of dogs, but as a non-driver, trying to get dehydrated, hungry, sick, possibly injured animals to my home in Seattle would be too much of a headache.

I've actually gotten quite a biting from a (possibly rabid) stray cat before and been through rabies treatments, so it is a risk I'm truly aware of the pain of. I've known a few people who have done animal rescues in SoCal after major fires, and it's pretty much being scratched to hell, fighting with scared, injured animals who have found themselves their own safe place and don't want anyone touching them. It's not a fun vacation, and it's not about snuggling with cuddly wuddly puppies and kittens. Animals, like humans, tend to go a bit feral when left to completely fend for themselves.

[CaptainJSparrow]

Linkster....what you said. You hit the nail on the head.

It's too bad that you folks can only watch the national news where each station is striving hard to scream "the sky is falling" the loudest and with the most emphasis on each and every word. We have a local station that is much more unbiased. We're seeing pictures from New Orleans that are filmed by locals. We're hearing stories from folks that we know that are in New Orleans right now, who are calling us, and telling us what is actually going on.

None of the authorities are shooting folks looting for food and water. There are stores in New Orleans, Walmart is one of them, that opened their doors and are giving away food and bottled water.

Nah, the looters that the authorities are ordered to shoot are the ones that are trying to take advantage of the situation. The ones that are stealing electronics and other valuables. The people that don't want to leave because, for them, it is a huge oportunity to steal.

My ex-wife's cousin stayed throughout the storm in Metarie, but left 2 days ago because she saw looters every night breaking into homes around her.

[Bill]

Well, I've been looking for news reports to confirm that there was murder, armed gangs, rampaging and rapes. So far nothing, but the day is young.

I did find this first hand report by two EMS folks who were trapped in a hotel by Katrina.

I think we all heard the story about how this group pooled money to hire a bus convoy to take them out of the city, but that the national guard stopped the busses and commandeered them for some unknown (to the news sources) use.

Well, this same group had a hard time, spending four days trapped inside the city.

http://www.emsnetwork.org/artman/pub...le_18337.shtml

Here's a bit from the article:

"From a woman with a battery powered radio we learned that the media was talking about us. Up in full view on the freeway, every relief and news organizations saw us on their way into the City. Officials were being asked what they were going to do about all those families living up on the freeway? The officials responded they were going to take care of us. Some of us got a sinking feeling. "Taking care of us" had an ominous tone to it.

Unfortunately, our sinking feeling (along with the sinking City) was correct. Just as dusk set in, a Gretna Sheriff showed up, jumped out of his patrol vehicle, aimed his gun at our faces, screaming, "Get off the fucking freeway". A helicopter arrived and used the wind from its blades to blow away our flimsy structures. As we retreated, the sheriff loaded up his truck with our food and water.

Once again, at gunpoint, we were forced off the freeway. All the law enforcement agencies appeared threatened when we congregated or congealed into groups of 20 or more. In every congregation of "victims" they saw "mob" or "riot". We felt safety in numbers. Our "we must stay together" was impossible because the agencies would force us into small atomized groups."

So - the authorities apparently _STOLE_ this groups food and water to force them out of the public eye.

[CaptainJSparrow]

On the local news, the New Orleans police chief just confirmed that his officers were shot at from the Superdome.

Also, the news confirmed that locals are throwing rocks at the National Guardsmen.

Gotta tell ya...the more I hear, I'm kinda embarrassed about our governor. I hear that the President gave her two options, and she told him she needed 24 hours to think about it. Apparently, she is having problems making decisions.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by CaptainJSparrow

Gotta tell ya...the more I hear, I'm kinda embarrassed about our governor. I hear that the President gave her two options, and she told him she needed 24 hours to think about it. Apparently, she is having problems making decisions.

You have heard her explantion, haven't you? She says that the president wanted her to hand over all authority for the area, possibly for the whole state. to the federal government, and I believe allow them to declare martial law.

She says she didn't believe it was in the best interests of the State of Louisiana to hand over the state to the federal government, and that she didn't want martial law to be declared.

There apparantly is a lot of backstory - about her thinking this was a CYA move by the pres, who could then ride in as a conquering hero and blame the state entirely for the delay.

There are two sides to every story.

[Linkster]

First off - lets get something straight as there has been a lot of misuse of terms here:
Martial Law isnt something a local government can request - it can be done by the president or recommended by his local area commander -
http://www.washingtonwatchdog.org/do...501.html#501.4

Secondly - the military cannot act as law enforcement by law in the US - unless congress specifically authorizes it under the Posse Comitatus Act:
http://www.nwc.navy.mil/library/3Pub...ibpossecom.htm

That said - A declaration of a "state of emergency" was made by the Governer prior to the hurricane coming ashore - that gave the President power to mobilize FEMA and the Coast Guard to assist locals

The real issue here is that the civilian population of this country thinks that the all mighty US government can just march in and do what it needs to do to help - by law it is specifically prohibited from doing just that - we fucking fought a civil war 150 years ago because of those laws - to prevent the government from telling states how to run their business - I know everybody thinks the issue was slavery - it wasnt - read the real history sometime.

I hate that sometimes we think that they should help out and they have even overstepped their bounds in many cases (like Fla hurricanes) - but those cases all used Natl Guard - which in this case took a few days to mobilize since there werent any available except for the soldiers in Miss - who were a little busy with their own problems

[Bill]

Well, here is a reference to a "shoot out".

The only shoot out that I've seen clearly mentioned on the TV news was an incident where supposedly armed men "on a briedge" fired at rescue workers, and the police fired back. The first report was the 5 locals had been killed, that was later revised to 2 killed, two wounded, and others missing.

One version of this I heard in a blog was that the men who were killed were not firing _at_ rescue workers, they were firing in the air to attract the attention of rescue workers. The police then fired on them. Not sure if this is true, but it does match some television reports I've seen, in which Nawliners were complaining that they were shot at after firing guns to attract help.

I'm not sure if this is the same incident:

From Reporters Sans Frontiers

http://www.rsf.org/article.php3?id_article=14894

Police violence against journalists in New Orleans in Katrina aftermath

"A second incident involved Gordon Russell of the New Orleans-based Times-Picayune daily as he was covering a shoot-out between police and local residents near the convention centre where hurricane victims were awaiting evacuation. The police detained Russell and smashed all of his equipment on the ground. Russell was forced to flee to avoid further violence and reportedly left the city the same day."

[Bill]

Does the local channel you are watching have a website Jeff?

As far as I'm concerned, Louisiana can shoot or imprision anybody they want to. It's not my state, and not my city. I don't live in the city. I assumed all cities have a hard core of poor and lower class people who commit most of the casual crime.

I'm just interested in the facts.

[Linkster]

Bill - nola.com has about the best news that seems to be accurate - they are the website of the Times-Picuyane (the NO newspaper) - there is also a small blog being run by the guys at DirecNic downtown at mgno.com - kinda isolated but they do have a birds eye view of the business district