a affiliate who uses my content for evil
 

Here is another little piss ant who wants to us my content for his redirects and also to help install whatever crap he is trying to install. (beware, you go to his sites you better have a good virus program)

I’ve already terminated his affiliate account, wrote a C&D to him and his host.

The 2 sites I know he has

bosomland.com
BUMPERBOOBS.COM

Registrant:
Chris Jerrett

12 Chestnut Close
Bath, Somerset BA3 3UY
United Kingdom

Registered through: GoDaddy.com (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: BUMPERBOOBS.COM
Created on: 25-Jan-04
Expires on: 25-Jan-05
Last Updated on: 25-Jan-04

Administrative Contact:
Jerrett, Chris kloot@btopenworld.com
12 Chestnut Close
Bath, Somerset BA3 3UY
United Kingdom
07939205198
Technical Contact:
Jerrett, Chris kloot@btopenworld.com
12 Chestnut Close
Bath, Somerset BA3 3UY
United Kingdom
07939205198

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.ADVANCEDHOSTERS.COM
NS2.ADVANCEDHOSTERS.COM

Too bad some of these assholes can't die of stupidity |lightsabe

Fucking twat.

He isn't typical of UK webmasters!

This fool is listed at lots of places..:(


Kloot

kloot@btopenworld.com
kloot@tiscali.co.uk

http://www.dildodames.com/
http://www.adult-gallery-post.com/
http://www.nudegrandmother.com/
http://www.teensexfuck.com/
http://www.mature-centerfolds.com/


Torn.:( you have lots of google spammers redirecting to KatVixen too|pissed|

http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...-8&q=kat+vixen

DD

um.... English please DD =o)

I've no idea what you mean; I'm not that savvy on this sort of thing. Just tell me who's balls do I need to crush?


|slice

AdvancedHosters is almost as bad as that other host HQHost. They are second for me for hosting cheaters when I check whois info. HQHost is already banned.

Yesterday I joined Katcash after viewing a thread on AWI in the opportunities forum. I listed about a dozen katcash hosted galleries on four tgps of mine to test the program.

One site I listed these hosted galleries on was http://www.bumperboobs.com this site sent between 50% and 100% to galleries depending on page. It also accepted webmaster submitted galleries and listed them. Indeed it did have an enter pop up. But there are (were) no redirects/spyware etc.

24 hours later I check my ccbill stats - no hits to katcash.

I check a gallery with my ref code and it goes to a page which says my ccbill id is cancelled and then it redirects to the katcash site.

I email Torn

Torn replies basically calling me a cheater. ALL I DID WAS LIST A DOZEN OF HER HOSTED GALLERIES ON A SITE WITH AN ENTER CONSOLE.

I immediately remove the hosted gallery links from my sites as requested within minutes and email her to tell her her links are removed

But too late.

Advanced hosters have deleted http://www.bumperboobs.com/ because Torn tells them I have unlicenced content there!

The other site Torn mentions is clean, always has been.

I object strongly to being called a cheater, a little piss ant, an asshole, a fucking twat, and a fool by people I respect in this Industry.

Dangerdave, you have listed me in the past, I've never cheated. and of those domains you listed three have been expired a while:
http://www.mature-centerfolds.com/
http://www.nudegrandmother.com/
http://www.teensexfuck.com/


Torn makes it sound like I submitted galleries with stolen content and redirected them. I have never done this in my fucking life.
All I did was list her hosted galls on a site with an entrance console. There are some very big tgps that do this. Are you guys calling them out as cheaters, etc. as well?

Thanks Mike for the kind words.

I don't deny that my site had an entrance console at all. But I just went through sextracker top 51 universe of sites and so do 9 of those sites. So I am in good company.

btw The site I have had deleted (damn it was a PR4!) at advanced hosters was on a server owned by someone else, not me. I'm still waiting to hear if the site is gone forever, it had a huge 6 months database of submitted galleries I hope I have not lost. I think advanced hosters are a good host.

LOL.... too bad.|2up

I see in my stats your site http://bumperboobs.com/ and since I have never seen that URL in my stats before I go and look and see what your site looks like, and the first thing that happens is my Norton pops up not once, not twice but THREE times telling me your trying to install crap on my pc.

Strike one.

I see about 4 thumbs of my content, so I click on one and when the new window pops I see one of your URLS for a second before it goes to my site. (no idea where that click also went)

Strike two.

I click on the second thumb and I get a pop for some BBW top list or whatever site that I have nothing to do with and NO WHERE do I see KatVixen.com

Strike three.

You Fucked up, instead of saying "sorry, I did wrong, I fucked up and it won’t happen again, give me another chance" you come back with "everyone does it"

Torn, no offence, but do you understand about traffic trading with trade scripts? Where a percentage of the traffic goes to a trade and a percentage goes to the gallery?

kloot - 1st off, who's Mike?

2ndly, just because everyone else does it, doesn't mean it's legit.

Now, here's where your argument fails:

You had Kat's content listed on your website, but not all the clicks that occured when a surfer clicked on her content went to Kat's site, which is how it should be.

This means that you were illegally using Kat's content for your own benefit, which is theft. You signed up to promote Kat's site by using her content - not to promote other sites/toplists.

I assume that you have never produced your own content, therefore have no idea the fucking hassle content producers go thru so that their content is not illegally used, as it was in this case.

If I were you, I'd rethink any website that you currently do this on, as it is illegal & this is just the 1st time you got caught. I assume there will be more.

So Greenie, what you're saying is that all Thumb TGPs should be shut down?

All my Thumb TGPs work that way. That doesn't make me a cheater nor do the sponsors think so (maybe because they know what a Thumb TGP is?). In order for me to grow my sites to 100k, 150k or 200k I need, as everyone else, to have the tools to do that. What you say Greenie is that we can't do it the way we do it with Thumb TGPs. Does that mean you can't write descriptions either from a gallery and at the same time use skimming? I can mention a whole lot of people here who does that.

And you're telling me that not on one single of your sites you use skimming on text links?

I send programs loads of traffic and sign ups and not ONE have ever been stupid enough to tell me it's illegal to run a Thumb TGP. In fact, just last week a huge program contacted me because they want me to grow 12 Thumb TGPs for them to 100k. So they know what it is and how it works.

The fact that Torn doesn't know Thumb TGPs says more about her than about Kloot.

Mike, thanx again, hope your post doesn't go again.

Green guy

First of all let me thank you for replying in a polite and professional manner. I'm not sucking ass. But your example is one which some of your other board members could learn from. I've been called a lot of bad names in this thread.

Who is Mike?
Someone who posted to defend me, but that post has gone from the board. I got the notification of a new post email, read the post, replied to it but now it's not there anymore.

Yes, I'm aware of the content issues on thumbsites. How many non-skim thumb sites do you know of? There are some but not many. So I get made an example of with my little site, and get it deleted. (Actually all the archive pages were text only, 100% to gallery).

"Her"????

Torn isn't a "her"!!!!

Although, he has been known to drink wine coolers in public, so I can understand your confusion.



|bananna|

1st off, I'm not a big fan of fucking over surfers with blind links & circle jerks & what I consider to be shit traffic, so I have no fucking clue how skims & trades & CJ's work.

That being said, the fact remains that kloot DID NOT have permission from Kat or Torn to use their content for his own benefit.

Like I said before, just because everyone else is doing it DOES NOT make it right, or in this case, even legal.

Oh - almost forgot - I assume there was a post deleted form this thread as well - that should not have been done, seeing as we encourage pissing matches :)

You don't know what trading is and yet you still trade traffic on http://www.link-o-rama.com/greenguy/mlinks.htm ?

Surely you know what trading traffic is. I think I remember we talked about it on ICQ some time ago and you told me you had lots TGPs. There are 25 sites on the box where link-o-rama is hosted. Not one of them is using a trade script of some sort?

Oh and another thing... I was looking for an extra server last night and was actually looking at Advanced Hosters. Thank God I didn't go with those people. My new Thumb TGPs would be down within 2 minutes judging by the way they do business. If there's some osrt of problem the host should at least say "hey you... we got a problem... how about you fix it...".

I got myself an Exon DUAL 2.8. That should be enough to power 3 new 100k Thumb TGPs.


RubberRuss,
I don't know Torn, other than what I heard from this (which is more than enough for me) :)

Yeah your right, I do not know anything about blind links and whatever crap it is that you do. All I know is when I click on a link expecting a apple and I see a banana instead, I get pissed and close the browser and I go look for a site that gives me what it says it will give me.

This is the main problem in porn, people doing anything to make a $. No wonder the US Gov is making our life so hard, who knows what that blind link will be.

I’m a pretty simple guy, I see my content being misused and I took action. Too bad “if everyone else does it” I don’t care. In the 4 years of having an affiliate program, I have terminated exactly 3 accounts total. Not too bad from 300+ affiliates over 4 years.

If this is “right” why was his site removed? I just told his host that he had 24 hours to remove it, after that it is a matter for my Lawyer to deal with. So did the host delete the site on my word alone or did they go and see what he was doing and see the crap for themselves?

I also have never had Norton popup on me for any other “entrance counsel” so that is pretty funny as well, but hey, call it what you want.

Also, if what you say is true about the blind links, why didn’t you use content YOU BOUGHT and not mine or anyone else’s? That’s stealing. Like I said, my content is for promoting my site and my site alone.

Pretty simple.

Torn,

We are hundreds of TGP webmasters and MANY of us got Thumb TGPs.
If you don't want those sites to promote your shit then add it to your terms. End of story.

I could understand your point if a site was using your thumbnails to promote another program but he's not. That only thing he's apparently doing wrong, accoding to you, is the fact that he's using a trade script to grow his site bigger so he can send you more traffic.

One of the sponsors I'm using on my Thumb TGPs is SilverCash. Would you SilverCash ppl like me to remove your SilverCash galleries because I'm using a trade script on the thumbs? Oh and should Madthumbs Mike also remove his links to your program?

Don't spin my words - I don't know how these bull shit blind link circle jerk trades work. Of course I know how legit hard link trades work & I have used them for the last 8 years.

And here's a little tip for when you look at things on whois.sc - this:
"Web server hosts 25 websites"
means there are 25 domains on the same IP on my server. There are actually about 200 domains on the server & about 100 on the other server I have with National Net. The ones that share the IP are typo's or similar domain spellings & all of them go to link-o-rama.com's date files. So whatever point you were trying to get across is pretty much moot.

But, the traffic & trades thing is NOT the issue here - the issue is that kloote DID NOT HAVE PERMISSION TO USE THE CONTENT IN THE WAY THAT HE DID. Torn & Kat give webmasters free content in exchange for them using that content to promote THEIR FUCKING SITE AND NOT TO PROMOTE ANY OTHER FUCKING SITE - PERIOD.

There is really nothing you can say to me, Torn, Kat, their lawyer, kloote's host, or anyone else reading this thread that will make someone believe this is not theft.


BUT HE WAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A quick tutorial on skimmed trading
 

Load up www.picminer.com/tgp.html

Pick a thumb and click on that same thumb 5 times. Chances are you will see the gallery 3-4 times, but the other times you will be 'jerked' to a trade.

This is skimming and in 2004 this is the normal way of TGP trading. "Skimless" TGPs - where every click on a gallery link really goes to the gallery - are now the exception.

Until this thread I had never heard any sponsors complain about affiliates using skimming to grow traffic. From what I understand, a couple of you are in uproar because a thumb with sponsor content didn't go to the gallery every single click.

I have to ask one thing: if a sponsor (Torn) offers hosted TGP galleries then surely they understand what skimming is? As I said, it's 2004...

Skimming, CJ or what ever ya want to call it sucks :( Oh sure lets put a thumb up for a lesbian gallery and send them to another tgp oh thats so effective :( Come on all your doing is inflating numbers and pissing off surfers and when you do it with hosted galleries or any ones content its miss use of there owned content plain and simple would you use a sponsors banner to send the surfer to another site? All the cj type tgps are the death of the tgps for sure the final nail in the coffin :(

I have one simple question that will end this thread forever - it's a "YES" or "NO" questions - so there is no debating:

Did kloot have permission from Torn/Kat to use their content the way he did?

Torn,

The reason there are so many thumb TGPs that still trade traffic is that NO ONE thinks or "knows" this is "illegal". Their sponsors are not bitching about it, so HOW COULD THEY KNOW? You are the FIRST I have heard complain about this. Perhaps you are the only one who views it this way? Perhaps its your self confessed unfamiliarity with traffic trading and the benefits it provides you that gives you this stance?

If I use one of your FHGs on a text link for trades, is that illegal too? Can you please let us know what ELSE you view as illegal that you did not put in your terms? Its only fair that we know. Of course that would rob you of the pleasure of flaming people on boards for doing things you think is wrong but everyone else thinks is business as usual, so I understand if you don't want to.

Perhaps you should go through and fire ALL your affilliates that use traffic trade scripts. Perhaps the impact on your business would help you understand traffic trading a little better.

It's called evolution. :)

Yes, skimfree TGPs are cleaner and tend to make more money per surfer... but these days it's far easier to grow a skimming TGP and make up for it with volume.

I'll go out on a limb here and give you some real figures. When my (skimming) TGP was at 100k, I was making approximately $US2000 per month from signups off hosted galleries. I'm sure plenty of you make more than this, but the beauty of this site is that it is nearly fully automated. Both trading and thumb rotation are handled by scripts. There is very little human intervention required, maybe 30 mins work average per day.

This is the future of TGPs. Bang in a thousand hosted gallery URLs and suitable thumbs, configure scripts, then let them do most of the work.

Interesting. I have never seen a sponsor kill an affliliate account for using a hosted gallery on a Thumb Preview site before.

Also, that host ... They close down a guys account because of a complaint of one thumbnail image? Which they didn't even bother to verfiy?

This has truly been an interesting thread.

Unfortuneately every thumb tgp that uses hosted galleries does this. They use content illegally so to speak. But most are clean sites for the most part sending surfers to the gallery a high percentage of the time.

kloot
You're problem was the popup. We all have a hate for those autoinstalls and spyware asses and if Norton went off then that pissed off Torn enough that when he saw your CJ site redirecting her thumbs to other sites it caused the problem you are in now. :(

Mike, how are you? You did a tgp design for me a while back.

MrMaryLou
Skimming TGPs are here to stay. They suck, I own one and I own a non skim TGP too. Sad to say but it is easy to grow one and still make some money with them.

Sounds like Torn only wants non-skimming TGPs to use his hosted galleries.. but UNFORTUNATELY there aren't many that are around that dont skim..

The non-skimming TGP days are long gone.. the only way to build up traffic now is by skimming a percentage to your trades..

What amazes me is that how so many people are out of touch with what's going on with their main traffic sources..

EDIT: if you were to send out emails to all the hosts of the TGPs that use your sponsor hosted galleries + skim to shut down their sites.. you will very soon be left with about 10 affiliates instead of 300..

Maybe you should put that in your FAQs page that you will not allow any TGP or MGP to use your hosted galleries if they skim

But how do you plan to get traffic? If TGPs skim, that's to gain more traffic, that means more traffic to YOUR program and more sales..

Too bad so many people dont know what's profiting or hurting them

Jesus H Christ On A Popsicle Stick! I can't believe you guys are still talking about "traffic"

kloot took an image from Kat & Torn & used to to promtoe a site other than Kat & Torn's site - what's part of the illegalness of this do some of you not understand?

Hmm, with regard to Kloot, yes the popups and auto installs suck balls and whilst I wouldnt trade with his site that is his business choice.

With regard to Torn, I suspect that you created the hosted galleries as everyone else does these days and hoped that it may attract a few affiliates. Unfortunately, the only webmasters who want hosted galleries are TGP owners, and nowadays it seems that the majority are thumb TGPs, 99% of which skim.

But perhaps the worst thing is that nowhere can I see a license which states the restrictions for the pics on the galleries or a set of terms where the restrictions on thumb TGPs skimming is stated. Considering that every other sponsor that offers hosted galleries never reports it as theft to a host, is it a fair assumption that yours shouldnt be any different?

Perhaps assumption is the mother of all fuck-ups, but I would be very concerned by this as someone that offers both clean and skimming sites.

I would be majorly pissed off if my host just dumped my sites without consulting me which I believe is what may have happened.

Would just like to add that skimming thumb TGP's, whilst they may suck, they can actually send you a lot of clicks to your program.

I would seek to embrace these webmasters as opposed to alienating them.

It's a sad fucking world when you have to put up a notice in your webmaster area that the webmaster can not steal your fucking content.

Seeing as no one wants to answer this - maybe it because you overlooked it :)

Did kloot have permission from Torn/Kat to use their content the way he did?

What I understand is that he did not use that image to promote any other program.. what you are referring to as promoting some other site is simply skimming a percentage of clicks to his trades which is very normal for a thumb tgp to do... so what's the clutter here?

I just made the above two posts without seeing this |potleaf|

Was it definately to another program or to another TGP?

I would bet it was to someone in his trade script.

If it was to another program then yes that would be naughty.

I never said he was promoting another program, I said he was promoting another SITE (even if I did have a few typo's in there - LOL)

Webmaster programs put out free content so that you can use it to promote their site - there is no other use for it - if you use it for something else, you run the risk of having shit like this happen to you.

I don't care if it was being used for a traffic trade, a circle jerk, a blind link or to promote the sale of socket sets on the fucking Sears Craftsman website!

kloot did not have permission to use the content the way he did & his host did the right thing when the pulled the plug after finding out from Torn just what was going on.

I am truly amazed at the number of people that think it is ok to steal content, as long as it's for a "traffic trade"

Using someone Else's content to skim is just plan wrong no matter how you shake it you can sit there all day and say oh I can make a site get a 100k that does make the fact that using someones content right :(

Sponsor content needs to be used in the VERY narrow confines of promoting the program. If you run a "skim" TGP, you need to set up certain galleries as 100% show, and use others (ie, content you have paid for) as higher skim to make up for it.

If your program cannot handle that, then I suggest you don't use sponsor content,

The use of sponsor content to promote another site, even if that other site is not a membership site is an invalid use of the content.

This isn't a question of "this sort of TGP is easier to promote / market / gain traffic on that that sort of TGP". Both types are valid business models, apparently. Using sponsor content on an uncontrolled "skim all listings" TGP is obviously in violation of the terms of use of that content (and thumbs generated from it). We are not discussing business models, we are discussing permitted use.

How hard is it to understand?

That there are sponsors out there that tolerate this sort of situation is up to those sponsors.

This guy should not have done what he did. Torn acted agressively and zealously as any copyright holder should to protect the images and to assure that use only as permitted.

HE WROTE THE RULES. YOU DON'T LIKE THE RULES, DON'T USE HIS CONTENT. IF YOU LIKE THE CONTENT, FOLLOW THE RULES.

How hard is it?

Alex

Okay, let's say it's illegal to do that and kloot was wrong and now the plug was pulled on him by his host.. but it would be a damn shame for Torn to not put something like that on his FAQs page that says that their program can only be used on non-skimming tgps and mgps..

now it's upto him to decide if he wants to take the hit and have about 200 of his affiliates drop him in a second.. because i know i would since there are 5000 other sponsors who actually wont give me shit about this and i wont have to worry at night that my site might be shut down because of some sponsor..

You can't really blame kloot for his actions because he presumed that it was okay to use Torn's content on a skimming tgp because other 5000 quality sponsors dont give him shit about it and get his sites shut down

If anything, i would blame Torn for not having something like that in his FAQs page..

And for you to say that the host did the right thing by pulling the plug on him after they saw that he was SKIMMING.. there are 50 million other decent sized tgps that do this.. so they should all be shut down?

Look at how it's gonna hurt so many sponsors.. and look at how it's gonna hurt so many hosts..

no skimming means no more huge traffic.. that means no more 100s of signups for the sponsors daily.. that means hosts will not burn much bw which will not fill their pockets..