Article says where porn use is up, rape goes down.

[Bill]

Here's a cheery article about some new study and it's measuremenst suggesting that where internet porn is most available, sexual violence is the least common. And it includes the good news that sexual assault is becoming less common.

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""Pornography is the theory; rape is the practice," wrote feminist author Robin Morgan. In 1986, a federal commission concurred. Some kinds of pornography, it concluded, are bound to lead to "increased sexual violence." Indianapolis passed a law allowing women to sue producers for sexual assaults caused by material depicting women in "positions of servility or submission or display."

The campaign fizzled when the courts said the ordinance was an unconstitutional form of "thought control." Though the Bush administration has put new emphasis on prosecuting obscenity, on the grounds that it fosters violence against women, pornography is more available now than ever.

That's due in substantial part to the rise of the Internet, where the United States alone has a staggering 244 million Web pages featuring erotic fare. One Nielsen survey found that one out of every four users say they visited adult sites in the last month.

So in the last two decades, we have conducted a vast experiment on the social consequences of such material. If the supporters of censorship were right, we should be seeing an unparalleled epidemic of sexual assault. But all the evidence indicates they were wrong. As raunch has waxed, rape has waned."


http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...ck=3&cset=true

"How can it be explained? Perhaps the most surprising and controversial account comes from Clemson University economist Todd Kendall, who suggests that adult fare on the Internet may essentially inoculate against sexual assaults.

In a paper presented at Stanford Law School last year, he reported that, after adjusting for other differences, states where Internet access expanded the fastest saw rape decline the most. A 10 percent increase in Internet access, Kendall found, typically meant a 7.3 percent reduction in the number of reported rapes. For other types of crime, he found no correlation with Web use. What this research suggests is that sexual urges play a big role in the incidence of rape -- and that pornographic Web sites provide a harmless way for potential predators to satisfy those desires.

That, of course, is only a theory, and the evidence he cites is not conclusive. States that were quicker to adopt the Internet may be different in ways that also serve to prevent rape. It's not hard to think of other explanations why sexual assaults have diminished so rapidly -- such as DNA analysis, which has been an invaluable tool in catching and convicting offenders.

Changing social attitudes doubtless have also played a role. Both young men and young women are more aware today of the boundaries between consensual and coercive sex. Kim Gandy, president of the National Organization for Women, thinks the credit for progress against rape should go to federal funding under the Violence Against Women Act and to education efforts stressing that "no means no."

But if expanding the availability of hard-core fare doesn't prevent rapes, we can be confident from the experience of recent years that it certainly doesn't cause such crimes. Whether you think porn is a constitutionally protected form of expression or a vile blight that should be eradicated, this discovery should come as very good news."

[tickler]

I remember reading something about sex offenders not using porn as much as the general public a long time ago.

And here it is.
In 1970 President Nixon’s Commission on Obscenity and Pornography did a study on the effects of pornography on the common person. They found that pornography is not only harmless, but is also a healthy part of growing up. The study showed that the majority of sexual offenders had been exposed to less pornography than average while growing up.

...and also...

In 1967, the Danish parliament took all restrictions off the sale of written and pictorial erotica. Danish researchers found the rate of sex crimes in Denmark dramatically decreased, finding that prospective sex offenders could relieve their tendencies by looking at pornography instead of engaging in the act itself
http://www.oregonlive.com/forums/hil....ssf?artid=124

[tickler]

Another article from Univ. of Pittsburg law school with similar results.

Internet Porn Shown to Reduce Incidence of Rape
However, D'Amato wrote in the Jurist Legal News and Research blog that the increased access to pornography is the social factor that correlates almost exactly with the decrease in rape.
http://www.avn.com/index.cfm?objecti...C0A70FF8B773F2

[Bill]

great finds - I wonder if there are more studies out there that say the same things?

[ecchi]

When videos first came in, you could get hold of any kind of porn in Britain, then a law was passed than effectively banned anything except the softest porn, and also effectively banned violent action films and violent horror films (Texas Chainsaw Massacre type films). Rape and violent crime shot up in Britain after that. It dropped a bit when the Internet became more widely used in the 90's and dropped a bit more when film censorship got less strict, but we are still left with a much more violent society (parts of Britain have the highest violent crime rate in Western Europe). And this from a county where a fatal shooting used to be a major headline, because fatal shootings used to be almost as rare as rocking horse shit!

[Bobc01]

Originally Posted by ecchi

but we are still left with a much more violent society (parts of Britain have the highest violent crime rate in Western Europe). And this from a county where a fatal shooting used to be a major headline, because fatal shootings used to be almost as rare as rocking horse shit!

It's all that gangster rap shit that's to blame.

All the kids talking like their black and thinking knives and guns earn them respect.

I'd drop the little cunts into the middle of Baghdad and see if they think guns are cool then.

[ecchi]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

It's all that gangster rap shit that's to blame

Hmm, well actually when "Gangster Rap" first became popular over here violent crime actually went DOWN very slightly.

[Bobc01]

Originally Posted by ecchi

Hmm, well actually when "Gangster Rap" first became popular over here violent crime actually went DOWN very slightly.

We've gone into a new generation of retards, kids are dumber than they've ever been, all this respect bollox and guns as fasion accessories.

Isn't from watching teletubbies is it? lol

[ecchi]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

Isn't from watching teletubbies is it? lol

No but it isn't from the music either. In fact, if you read the articles quoted by other people, and my first post, it is probable that the problem would be WORSE without the "music".

[ArtWilliams]

Rape goes down when we appreciate women as the sex goddesses they are.

[Bobc01]

Originally Posted by ecchi

No but it isn't from the music either. In fact, if you read the articles quoted by other people, and my first post, it is probable that the problem would be WORSE without the "music".

It's the music (if you can call it that) that inspires the culture of drugs and guns, proven fact.
Gang culture inspired by gangster (c)rap, get rid of the culture and ??

[ecchi]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

It's the music (if you can call it that) that inspires the culture of drugs and guns, proven fact.
Gang culture inspired by gangster (c)rap, get rid of the culture and ??

You really haven't read any of the articles quoted in this thread at all, they point they make is EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE.

The point you quote is the excuse the government makes for it's failure to do anything about the problem, and while gullible people like you happily quote the party propaganda I guess it proves the old maxim that "the people always get the government they deserve".

[Bobc01]

I guess if it's in an article it must be true.

You kind of get a clue with "Gangster (c)rap" and "Gangs"?
The way they look and their attitudes, it's all influenced by the music?

Sorry must be what they're teaching in schools now on how to earn respect by shooting each other, my, how things have changed.
I remember learning different things in school.
What you going to say next that hard drugs don't fuel addictions?
Maybe that's in an article somewhere.

I don't vote, never have and never will as politicians to me are all the same breed of arseholes.

[ecchi]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

I guess if it's in an article it must be true.

Actually I was only suggesting that you look at the articles because they are there. I did research on this years ago, for several reasons. Go to your local library (or if your local library is a small one it may have to be the central library). Ask in the reference section for the book on crime statistics (sorry cannot remember what it is called, but just ask for "crime statistics", they should know which book you mean, it is what I ask for and they always know what I want). You will need several editions because although it covers several years, one copy does not cover 25 years, you'll have to get the current one, and a couple of older ones. Then draw yourself a graph of the last 25 years of violent crime. Plot on it things like the VRA and the rise in popularity of gangster rap, you will find the number of violent crimes goes up sharply after the VRA came into force, but the number of violent crimes GOES DOWN slightly when "gangsta rap" begins to get popular over here.

The reason for this is that some people are violent by nature (or possibly nurture). They need to get it out of their system. Things like gangsta rap do this for some people. Instead of starting a fight or attacking someone they hate, they rap about "popping a cap in there ass" (or whatever). Have you ever had a row with someone who was being a complete arsehole and wanted to hit them, but end up punching the wall instead? It is the same thing.

Originally Posted by Bobc01

You kind of get a clue with "Gangster (c)rap" and "Gangs"?The way they look and their attitudes, it's all influenced by the music?

Yes music is a popular bogey man. A while back it was "Gangster rap warps our kid's minds", before that it was "Heavy metal warps our kid's minds", prior to that it was "Punk rock warps our kid's minds", further back still rock 'n' roll, and before that jazz. Believe it or not, when I was researching an article on Lord Nelson I came across an report written somewhere between 100 and 200 years ago talking about the "corrupting" influence of ballet music, which had just been introduced from France. Parliament were considering banning this immoral music and the obscene dances people did to it!

Originally Posted by Bobc01

I don't vote, never have and never will as politicians to me are all the same breed of arseholes.

I didn't suggest that you did vote for the government, I merely pointed out that to defend themselves from claims that they are not doing enough to combat violence, the government got their spin doctors to deflect blame onto something else, and Alister Campbell, or someone like him, came up with the old chestnut of "it's that devil's music what is to blame", and you, you old Victor Meldrew you, went along with the "kids of today, and their evil music, mumble grumble....." type whine!

In short, no I agree don't automatically believe everything you read, do what I did, look up the figures, and do a bit of research. Don't automatically believe what the government spin doctors tell you. And, hey I'm the middle aged guy, I'm the one supposed to be a "Victor Meldrew", not you!

[Bobc01]

lol depends what you call middle aged, i'm 39 and i suppose it is a "grumpy old man" attitude i have as i don't remember things being half as bad as they are now.

Take that doorman who was killed for so called "disrespecting" the kids he asked to put their cigerettes out, where does all that come from?

To get a real picture, ask cops on their angle instead of unreliable crime statistics, one cop told me the best way to deal with the fuckers is to get them all into a big field and let them shoot it out and then arrest the survivors for murder.

When i left the UK in 97 and came back in 02 the first thing people said to me was how much it had changed over here and it wasn't untill i saw white kids dressing and acting like they were black with their gobby attitudes i thought fuck, i've landed in the wrong country.

All music creates it's cultures but gangster (c)rap glamourising guns, knives etc is the main influence with the extreme violent crimes we have now.

[ecchi]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

To get a real picture, ask cops on their angle instead of unreliable crime statistics

I have two friends in the police, and one who used to work in stations but as a civilian, so I have met many cops. I have learnt to keep very quiet about what I do when talking to them, because most cops think the main cause of all that is evil in the world is pornography!!!

However I think we should stop this discussion as it is getting pointless. You insist on considering all evidence against your beliefs as "unreliable", and instead hang desperately onto election propaganda spewed out by government spin doctors, so I guess there is no point in arguing with you. Let's just drop it before everyone else on this board starts committing violent crimes to relieve their boredom!

No hard feelings I hope?

[RageCash-Ben]

Interesting to see both sides of the argument here.

[Bobc01]

Originally Posted by ecchi

I have two friends in the police, and one who used to work in stations but as a civilian, so I have met many cops. I have learnt to keep very quiet about what I do when talking to them, because most cops think the main cause of all that is evil in the world is pornography!!!

However I think we should stop this discussion as it is getting pointless. You insist on considering all evidence against your beliefs as "unreliable", and instead hang desperately onto election propaganda spewed out by government spin doctors, so I guess there is no point in arguing with you. Let's just drop it before everyone else on this board starts committing violent crimes to relieve their boredom!

No hard feelings I hope?

Why would there be hard feelings? everyone has a different opinion on most things.

You're wrong but i'm not going to argue

Porn has always had a bad name, probably by typical stereotyping, but more so now through the crime it generates.
I expect all the cops ever hear is about the bad side like most people and don't realise that we all fight the shit aswell.

[SirMoby]

Originally Posted by Bobc01

It's all that gangster rap shit that's to blame.

What did you listen to as a young teenager? Many in my generation were listening to Ozzy, Judas Priest and AC/DC. The music didn't cause us to kill ourselves by over dosing on drugs.

Problems are a little more complex then just a single source of noise.

Sure, gangster rap isn't nice but there's a reason why kids find it appealing. Figure that out and then you might be on to something.

[Bobc01]

Originally Posted by SirMoby

What did you listen to as a young teenager? Many in my generation were listening to Ozzy, Judas Priest and AC/DC. The music didn't cause us to kill ourselves by over dosing on drugs.

Problems are a little more complex then just a single source of noise.

Sure, gangster rap isn't nice but there's a reason why kids find it appealing. Figure that out and then you might be on to something.

I listened to pretty much the same as you and the same as with drugs.

Who knows the attraction with (c)rap, i expect its a way of rebelion as kids always want their own way.
Most vulnerable people fear gangs here in the UK so i can imgaine that that's part of the appeal as the kids imagine it gains them respect.
My ex wife tells me Australia is becoming the same with gangs so there has to be some kind of connection as it's the same music the kids are idolising.