Anyone here feel best qualified to be point man with the FSC?

SirMoby · 2006-02-15, 02:57 PM

Yes, I'm a member and I think no matter what the FSC deserves support from everyone that is benefiting from their efforts. Lack of online signup is an excuse and not a reason for nonsupport.

Are they perfect? Nope, but who else is stepping up to fight the legal battle for the right to free speech and privacy?

As RawAlex points out you don't have to be a member to support them. I would like them to improve many things but they are doing what is most important and that is protecting people from the legal nut cases that feel rights are only for those identical to themselves.

I will request 2 things before I renew though.

1. They keep fighting the legal battles just like they are now. No need to change things.

2. Get back in front of the Senate and correct the false statements. Such as explaining that most responsible webmasters are labeling their sites, that AVS cannot work based on today's technology and that we are more then happy to work on a better labeling system that can be easily adopted by all sites including news sites.

To me that's what's most important.

Bill · 2006-02-15, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirMoby

Lack of online signup is an excuse and not a reason for nonsupport.

It's not an excuse, it's a political demand.

I plan on not renewing my membership unless I can do it online.

And I will be trying to persuade others to do likewise.

Politics is all about symbolism and messages. The symbolism of not having an online method to take memberships and donations is profound.

It says, loudly and unmistakeably, "We don't give a fuck about you onliners.".

It is a core issue. A line in the sand. If they can't get their shit together enough to install a goddamn CC processor they are not worthy of onliner support.

I am totally committed to this position.

SirMoby · 2006-02-15, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill

It's not an excuse, it's a political demand.

I plan on not renewing my membership unless I can do it online.

Using an online processor for $100s of dollars where nothing is actually shipped has charge back written all over it. I would have concerns about accepting $300 from webmasters that understand chargebacks. Wouldn't you if it was your business?

Toby · 2006-02-15, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirMoby

Using an online processor for $100s of dollars where nothing is actually shipped has charge back written all over it. I would have concerns about accepting $300 from webmasters that understand chargebacks. Wouldn't you if it was your business?

Sorry SirMoby but you're all wet on this one. An FSC membership isn't like a pay site membership where you can download all the content in a few days. The value is in being a member, not in having been a member. Chargebacks is a non-issue.

Cost is also a non-issue. The number of additional people that would join if there were an online registration available would offset any costs for the CC processing many times over.

It's simply a matter of making it a priority and getting it done.

SirMoby · 2006-02-15, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toby

Sorry SirMoby but you're all wet on this one. An FSC membership isn't like a pay site membership where you can download all the content in a few days. The value is in being a member, not in having been a member. Chargebacks is a non-issue.

Cost is also a non-issue. The number of additional people that would join if there were an online registration available would offset any costs for the CC processing many times over.

It's simply a matter of making it a priority and getting it done.

How many webmasters would have charged back after the list of companies went to the DOJ? How many might try to chargeback now that the ruling came into play?

I'm sure at least a few would have charged back. I can't imagine someone really wanting to donate money and allowing a 3 minute process to stand in the way.

There's a reason why most sites that sell advertising don't use credit card processing and we seem to have no problems buying advertising using other methods.

Far-L · 2006-02-15, 05:09 PM

GG: want to do a radio show interview with spike and tom hymes?

Bill · 2006-02-15, 03:45 PM

SirMoby, if that's the best counterargument you can muster, then I am led to believe that you see the political wisdom and message of my argument.

I personally doubt that any webmaster who would join or renew in the first place would chargeback.

But, that is a technical issue, to be resolved in the backend. I can think of several solutions, including publishing the information on chargebacks.

I make political donations all the time - organizations like moveon don't seem to be having a big chargeback issue.

However, perhaps you are suggesting that the FSC fears it will be punished for incompetence or nonaction thru chargebacks?

SirMoby · 2006-02-15, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill

SirMoby, if that's the best counterargument you can muster, then I am led to believe that you see the political wisdom and message of my argument.

You're making an assumption here and I'm sure you know where that's going to go.

It's not an arguement. It's a fact that many webmasters in our business buy things and charge them back months later for many reasons.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill

However, perhaps you are suggesting that the FSC fears it will be punished for incompetence or nonaction thru chargebacks?

Come on Bill. Why are you trying to lead my thoughts? I thought we were reasonable adults here.

Bill · 2006-02-15, 04:39 PM

Ah, well, politics is, among other things, the art of leading thoughts thru symbolism and message.

Forgive me for a bit of thought leading.

We don't have to agree on this. But, I will continue to make a CC processing capacity a core issue.

For me it is the _first_ issue. A website that meets the needs of we onliners is the absolute minimum. If the FSC can't meet us at least to that point, I will start looking for another organization that can.

Maybe the Adult Freedom Foundation is looking for members.

2006-02-15, 05:09 PM	#6
Far-L Are you sure this is the Sci-Fi Convention? It's full of nerds! Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 265	GG: want to do a radio show interview with spike and tom hymes? __________________ www.homegrowncontent.com www.homegrowncash.com

2006-02-15, 02:57 PM	#1
SirMoby Jim? I heard he's a dirty pornographer. Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 2,706	Yes, I'm a member and I think no matter what the FSC deserves support from everyone that is benefiting from their efforts. Lack of online signup is an excuse and not a reason for nonsupport. Are they perfect? Nope, but who else is stepping up to fight the legal battle for the right to free speech and privacy? As RawAlex points out you don't have to be a member to support them. I would like them to improve many things but they are doing what is most important and that is protecting people from the legal nut cases that feel rights are only for those identical to themselves. I will request 2 things before I renew though. 1. They keep fighting the legal battles just like they are now. No need to change things. 2. Get back in front of the Senate and correct the false statements. Such as explaining that most responsible webmasters are labeling their sites, that AVS cannot work based on today's technology and that we are more then happy to work on a better labeling system that can be easily adopted by all sites including news sites. To me that's what's most important.

2006-02-15, 03:45 PM	#7
Bill Selling porn allows me to stay in a constant state of Bliss - ain't that a trip! Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 3,914	SirMoby, if that's the best counterargument you can muster, then I am led to believe that you see the political wisdom and message of my argument. I personally doubt that any webmaster who would join or renew in the first place would chargeback. But, that is a technical issue, to be resolved in the backend. I can think of several solutions, including publishing the information on chargebacks. I make political donations all the time - organizations like moveon don't seem to be having a big chargeback issue. However, perhaps you are suggesting that the FSC fears it will be punished for incompetence or nonaction thru chargebacks?

2006-02-15, 04:39 PM	#9
Bill Selling porn allows me to stay in a constant state of Bliss - ain't that a trip! Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 3,914	Ah, well, politics is, among other things, the art of leading thoughts thru symbolism and message. Forgive me for a bit of thought leading. We don't have to agree on this. But, I will continue to make a CC processing capacity a core issue. For me it is the _first_ issue. A website that meets the needs of we onliners is the absolute minimum. If the FSC can't meet us at least to that point, I will start looking for another organization that can. Maybe the Adult Freedom Foundation is looking for members.