Bush can't have it both ways - 2257

[RawAlex]

Jug, the reality of the situaiton will sadly come clear on Monday - The US south has already been effectively overrun by immigrants (many illegals) and enough of them vote that no politician is willing ot cut off his balls to get the job done.

Securing the US border could be accomplished in any number of ways. I have always felt that having a number of US military installations moved from other places and put near the border would help out tremendously. Declare most of the land as bombing test sites, military test ranges, and secured military facilities, and then put your national guard and whatnot on duty to protect the facilities, and suddenly border crossing would drop dramatically.

If anyone was serious about immigration, they would in major force busting the day laborers and whatnot and hustling the people who hire them until the market place dries up. Take the economic incentives away, and the problem will shrink.

Alex

[virgohippy]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

If anyone was serious about immigration, they would in major force busting the day laborers and whatnot and hustling the people who hire them until the market place dries up. Take the economic incentives away, and the problem will shrink.

Maybe it's because I've lived in California all my life, but wouldn't it be self-defeating to take away economic incentives? I mean, sure, we can make it economically harder for the immigrants... but we'd just be fucking with our own local economies in the meantime.

Originally Posted by Tommy

the same argument was made for slavery but instead of picking fruit they were picking cotton

I'm not sure I understand you Tommy, but which argument was that? Cuz it seems to me the problem isn't that people living in poverse conditions are unable to find a way up... it's that they've found one that's beneficial for many, though still illegal.

[juggernaut]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Jug, the reality of the situaiton will sadly come clear on Monday - The US south has already been effectively overrun by immigrants (many illegals) and enough of them vote that no politician is willing ot cut off his balls to get the job done.

Not sure I understand you here Alex. Illegals can't vote. Even legal ones like my wife. Only citizens can vote, my wife is a perminate resident which means she only has the rights of a US citizen but still can't vote. Greencard holders are not citizens, it's only a card for work purposes but not voting unless that has changed.

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Securing the US border could be accomplished in any number of ways. I have always felt that having a number of US military installations moved from other places and put near the border would help out tremendously. Declare most of the land as bombing test sites, military test ranges, and secured military facilities, and then put your national guard and whatnot on duty to protect the facilities, and suddenly border crossing would drop dramatically.

Agree 100% only problem is they won't put the NG on this duty for 1 reason, money. Not for the short term cost but the long term, the NG would fight to get this duty classified as a danger zone which would mean more pay, which in the end would mean a higher pension. I know I have been there with the bridges and tunnels. They would put us on duty for 89 days, because anything over 90 gets listed as active duty time which counts towards retirement points. After 1 week of leave they drop you back on duty for another 89 days. Fucked up shit but that's what they do. Also this would need to be a fulltime gig, this could not be completed with a weekend force. Not to mention everytime someone walks off a base with an M-16 you have major local legal issues. A NG soldier is a federal soldier but in order to fire their weapon they need the ok from a state agency. What some people here don't know is the NG guys/gals at these bridges and tunnels do not have ammo in their rifles, or at least they are not supposed to. Also they cannot fire on a hostile unless given the order from a state trooper. But I agree this would be a better way, if they could work out the issues.

Originally Posted by RawAlex

If anyone was serious about immigration, they would in major force busting the day laborers and whatnot and hustling the people who hire them until the market place dries up. Take the economic incentives away, and the problem will shrink.

Alex

Agree again, problem is this will go much deeper for the short term if not longer. Allot of industries who use these guys are using them for cost savings. Take away the savings and the customer gets pissed and stops buying. I think it would be better to allow prison workers to do this work along with people on welfair. You want help from the government you have to earn it for a period of time. It would be interesting to see how many people stop having babies just for a paycheck.