Offshore Hosting (USA)

twintone · 2006-10-11, 04:13 PM

What's the point in hosting out of the US if you live in the US? US law applies to you no matter where you host your sites.

Spend the money and talk to a lawyer and you will find out a lot of interesting things. |goodidea

chilihost · 2006-10-12, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twintone

What's the point in hosting out of the US if you live in the US? US law applies to you no matter where you host your sites.

Spend the money and talk to a lawyer and you will find out a lot of interesting things. |goodidea

The DOJ cannot walk into an NL data center and demand that a server be unplugged. Plus its your primary point of business that is most important, if you live in the USA but your primary point of business is elsewhere then using offshore hosting is the logical choice. Finally, do you know for certain that DJilla lives in the USA or will be living in the USA in the future?

cheers,
Luke

twintone · 2006-10-12, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chilihost

The DOJ cannot walk into an NL data center and demand that a server be unplugged. Plus its your primary point of business that is most important, if you live in the USA but your primary point of business is elsewhere then using offshore hosting is the logical choice. Finally, do you know for certain that DJilla lives in the USA or will be living in the USA in the future?

cheers,
Luke

If you don't think other countries work with the DOJ or any other branch of the US government you are sadly mistaken.

If his residence is in the US, and he is working out of his home, or office space in the US, then his point of business is in the US period.

I know he lives in the US due to his whois info. Does it mean it is correct? Not necessarily, but we both know it is not good to have forged whois info if you plan on keeping your domain.

Here is an example. This was recently shut down for breaking copy right laws. The site was hosted in China I believe, so the FBI took the domain and hunted down the owner of the site who lives in the US.

http://ibackups.net/

Ever hear of supernova.org? They were a Slovenian based website, shut down by legal threats. How could someone in Hollywood ever touch them half way across the world?

Another would be isonews which was shut down by the US, yet hosted in Europe as well. How can this be? Don't think Holland or the Netherlands, or anywhere else is out of reach for the US government, you would only be fooling yourself.

I don't know you, but have seen you on boards for years, and think you know a bit about what you are talking about. I just don't think you are totally informed, as any of us really are when it comes to 2257. What I do know is, the US has shut down a lot of sites outside the US for other things, what is going to stop them from doing the same under 2257?

Have you gathered any facts from a lawyer? I have, and was told if you live in the US as your main residence, and run a website that falls under 2257 or anything else illegal in the US it does not matter where you host your sites, they can, and will, take you down.

Why risk it to be lazy? Comply with the law and have some piece of mind.

twintone · 2006-10-12, 04:48 PM

Washington, DC
September 29, 2006

United States Joins Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime

Today the United States became a party to the Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime. The Convention will enter into force for the United States on January 1, 2007.

The Convention is the only legally binding multilateral instrument specifically addressing computer-related crime, helping protect citizens against computer hacking and Internet fraud, as well as crimes involving electronic evidence, including child sexual exploitation (which is 2257), organized crime and terrorism. Parties to the Convention commit to effective and compatible laws and tools to fight cybercrime, and to cooperating to investigate and prosecute these crimes. Ratification of the Convention strengthens the United States’ ongoing leadership in these efforts.

The Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime is a global approach to the global problem of computer crime. The United States urges all states to consider joining the Convention.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2006/73353.htm

.

chilihost · 2006-10-13, 01:24 PM

twintone,
2257 regulations are specific to the USA. 2257 is VERY different from child porn or copyright regulations. Other countries have cp/copyright laws in place and it is common for countries to cooperate on prosecutions for these laws. But, no other country in the world has the strict regulations and requirements of 2257.

If you are running a mature sex site and your primary point of business is outside of the USA (yet live in the USA), the DOJ cannot legally walk into a NL data center and demand that the server be unplugged for 2257 violations (they have no authority outside of their juristiction), nor can they ask that local NL authorities take action as there is no NL equivalent to these regs (and they can't say its due to child protection as a mature site is pretty obviously not cp).

All I was trying to say is that there are a lot of legit reasons to want offshore hosting. DJilla never mentioned any reason, but you assumed it was to dodge US laws...actually he did not even mention if it was for a US citizen or US corporation.

One other thing, child sexual exploitation is NOT 2257. 2257 is the administrative requirements and documentation regulations that are imposed by the DOJ, in their effort to curbe cp.

And, no, I am not a lawyer and I highly recommend everyone speaks with their local lawyer about any legal concerns. I spoke to one and got a legal opinion for my specific situation.

cheers,
Luke

DJilla · 2006-10-12, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twintone

What's the point in hosting out of the US if you live in the US? US law applies to you no matter where you host your sites.

Spend the money and talk to a lawyer and you will find out a lot of interesting things. |goodidea

Is that a question or a professional statement? Why would you infer that I am in some way attempting to evade US law? I love America, I pay my taxes, and I follow the law. I am a professional and so regularly spend money on professional services and I have more than one legal resource to consult in case I require guidance on a matter but thank you for your cogent advice.

Perhaps this post is for an offshore client.
Perhaps its to construct an offshore company.
Perhaps its for backup.
Perhaps its for price comparison.
Perhaps you presumed to much

Perhaps you presumed too much...

The info you have posted is essentially correct has far as it goes having to do with pornographers and their current 2257 worries. If that's the extent of your hysteria don't worry too much it'll blow over like it always has since the 50s during these type of "crackdowns But, its clear you are missing the bigger picture as well as an understanding that its a 24 / 7 globe that never turns off.

Now I was wondering if you did or didn't know of a good offshore host?

2006-10-11, 04:13 PM	#1
twintone Heh Heh Heh! Lisa! Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos! Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 77	What's the point in hosting out of the US if you live in the US? US law applies to you no matter where you host your sites. Spend the money and talk to a lawyer and you will find out a lot of interesting things. \|goodidea __________________

2006-10-12, 04:48 PM	#4
twintone Heh Heh Heh! Lisa! Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos! Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 77	Washington, DC September 29, 2006 United States Joins Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime Today the United States became a party to the Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime. The Convention will enter into force for the United States on January 1, 2007. The Convention is the only legally binding multilateral instrument specifically addressing computer-related crime, helping protect citizens against computer hacking and Internet fraud, as well as crimes involving electronic evidence, including child sexual exploitation (which is 2257), organized crime and terrorism. Parties to the Convention commit to effective and compatible laws and tools to fight cybercrime, and to cooperating to investigate and prosecute these crimes. Ratification of the Convention strengthens the United States’ ongoing leadership in these efforts. The Council of Europe Convention on Cybercrime is a global approach to the global problem of computer crime. The United States urges all states to consider joining the Convention. http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2006/73353.htm . __________________

2006-10-13, 01:24 PM	#5
chilihost Look at 'em. Watchin' my TV. Sittin on my couch. You better not be in my ass groove! Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 465	twintone, 2257 regulations are specific to the USA. 2257 is VERY different from child porn or copyright regulations. Other countries have cp/copyright laws in place and it is common for countries to cooperate on prosecutions for these laws. But, no other country in the world has the strict regulations and requirements of 2257. If you are running a mature sex site and your primary point of business is outside of the USA (yet live in the USA), the DOJ cannot legally walk into a NL data center and demand that the server be unplugged for 2257 violations (they have no authority outside of their juristiction), nor can they ask that local NL authorities take action as there is no NL equivalent to these regs (and they can't say its due to child protection as a mature site is pretty obviously not cp). All I was trying to say is that there are a lot of legit reasons to want offshore hosting. DJilla never mentioned any reason, but you assumed it was to dodge US laws...actually he did not even mention if it was for a US citizen or US corporation. One other thing, child sexual exploitation is NOT 2257. 2257 is the administrative requirements and documentation regulations that are imposed by the DOJ, in their effort to curbe cp. And, no, I am not a lawyer and I highly recommend everyone speaks with their local lawyer about any legal concerns. I spoke to one and got a legal opinion for my specific situation. cheers, Luke __________________ HunkMoney+BritishBucks+LatinoBucks=50+ gay sites! Last edited by chilihost; 2006-10-13 at 01:27 PM..