1001 questions from a newbie.... me.

[Kisa]

I just can't get past sites like this http://www.pornhub.com/

I just can't get past that.... I'm looking at it and I'm thinking, why would anyone want to look at a few previews?

Are the distributors and studios going after sites like that one or is it just being accepted? It can't just be accepted... the studios, distributors, etc would stand to lose too much money if they don't start getting control of at least some of it...

But I go back to my original theory which is, I have no problem making the standard three page freesite (that I completely did not understand before) but I still don't know why anyone would wade through layers of links and then click through several pages when they can just go to pornhub or youporn?? I'm seriously not trying to be difficult... just trying to work it all out.

I would also add that submitting freesites and posting those links, etc is obviously the 'right' thing to do but if no one is pushing back against fucktards who are stealing content and posting it in its entirety, then everyone is doomed.... I got over the whole 'share' thing years ago when I finally had to start working. But it's hard to convince some little shit in a dorm room that people don't actually work for free so he can get off.... posting all that content is stealing but if no one's going after them then I guess it's theirs for the taking??? I don't know... I have no idea what's being done to stop it.

[Useless]

Originally Posted by Kisa

I just can't get past sites like this pornhub.com

Please don't link to sites like that in the future. (Typing the full URL allows the board software to automatically create a link.)

Originally Posted by Kisa

Are the distributors and studios going after sites like that one or is it just being accepted? It can't just be accepted... the studios, distributors, etc would stand to lose too much money if they don't start getting control of at least some of it...

Yes and no. Many, maybe most, studios and license owners are constantly on search-and-kill missions to remove their content from sites infringing on their copyrights. But as along as a few scumbag sponsors, e.g., AdultFriendFinder, Brazzers, etc., continue to support such sites with ad revenue, they aren't going away - and since non-tube webmasters continue to promote sponsors like that, the funding for tube sites is not being choked off.

Originally Posted by Kisa

But I go back to my original theory which is, I have no problem making the standard three page freesite (that I completely did not understand before) but I still don't know why anyone would wade through layers of links and then click through several pages when they can just go to pornhub or youporn??

The key is to get the surfer to your site first. Chances are, if they aren't already surfing stolen porn on a tube site, they either don't know about them or they're searching for something in particular. Grabbing those unspoiled surfers is typically about search engine optimization (SEO). If you can get your pages higher in the search results than the tubes, you get the first chance at the sale and the opportunity to keep that surfer away from the tubes.

Why would a surfer "wade through layers of links" to get at the porn? It's funny what a person with the will to get off will do. Certain surfers have always been willing to work their way through our labyrinth of ad spots during their search for whatever it is that works for them. Why do I PAY for television programming and still deal with commercials? Because that's how it is and they HAVE ME BY THE BALLS. (Hi ned.) A desire's need to be satiated overrides logic.

Originally Posted by Kisa

I would also add that submitting freesites and posting those links, etc is obviously the 'right' thing to do but if no one is pushing back against fucktards who are stealing content and posting it in its entirety, then everyone is doomed.... I got over the whole 'share' thing years ago when I finally had to start working. But it's hard to convince some little shit in a dorm room that people don't actually work for free so he can get off.... posting all that content is stealing but if no one's going after them then I guess it's theirs for the taking??? I don't know... I have no idea what's being done to stop it.

As a lone webmaster, you can't do much. The key is to remain focused on your pages, your sites, your little piece of the web. You're an intelligent person; think of ways to get those surfers before the evil empire can. Have your pages set up to immediately grab any porn surfer's attention the moment they land on your site, even if they were searching for a (goddamn) tube site.

<spam>
Many sponsors now offer embeddable Flash videos for use on your pages. One of my favorite sponsors, MovieRoom, just launched a great embeddable Flash movie player. If you put that movie player above the fold on your pages, a tube surfer will probably think that he/she has landed on a new tube site. It plays short clips, but it allows the surfer to view several clips, even change channels, without leaving your page. (It's available in multiple dimensions and you can choose which niche you want loaded first.)
</spam>

Optimizing for tube surfers/non-readers doesn't mean that you need to hand them a bunch of porn up front. Keep a good balance of SEO text and smartly named images. Give samples without giving away the farm. Providing more free porn than the next guy won't produce more sales. Tube sites are proof of that. Their ratios are reported to be absolute shit. But once you build Frankenstein, it's damn hard to put him down.

[Kisa]

Originally Posted by Useless Warrior

Please don't link to sites like that in the future. (Typing the full URL allows the board software to automatically create a link.)
Yes and no. Many, maybe most, studios and license owners are constantly on search-and-kill missions to remove their content from sites infringing on their copyrights. But as along as a few scumbag sponsors, e.g., AdultFriendFinder, Brazzers, etc., continue to support such sites with ad revenue, they aren't going away - and since non-tube webmasters continue to promote sponsors like that, the funding for tube sites is not being choked off.
The key is to get the surfer to your site first. Chances are, if they aren't already surfing stolen porn on a tube site, they either don't know about them or they're searching for something in particular. Grabbing those unspoiled surfers is typically about search engine optimization (SEO). If you can get your pages higher in the search results than the tubes, you get the first chance at the sale and the opportunity to keep that surfer away from the tubes.

Why would a surfer "wade through layers of links" to get at the porn? It's funny what a person with the will to get off will do. Certain surfers have always been willing to work their way through our labyrinth of ad spots during their search for whatever it is that works for them. Why do I PAY for television programming and still deal with commercials? Because that's how it is and they HAVE ME BY THE BALLS. (Hi ned.) A desire's need to be satiated overrides logic.


As a lone webmaster, you can't do much. The key is to remain focused on your pages, your sites, your little piece of the web. You're an intelligent person; think of ways to get those surfers before the evil empire can. Have your pages set up to immediately grab any porn surfer's attention the moment they land on your site, even if they were searching for a (goddamn) tube site.

<spam>
Many sponsors now offer embeddable Flash videos for use on your pages. One of my favorite sponsors, MovieRoom, just launched a great embeddable Flash movie player. If you put that movie player above the fold on your pages, a tube surfer will probably think that he/she has landed on a new tube site. It plays short clips, but it allows the surfer to view several clips, even change channels, without leaving your page. (It's available in multiple dimensions and you can choose which niche you want loaded first.)
</spam>

Optimizing for tube surfers/non-readers doesn't mean that you need to hand them a bunch of porn up front. Keep a good balance of SEO text and smartly named images. Give samples without giving away the farm. Providing more free porn than the next guy won't produce more sales. Tube sites are proof of that. Their ratios are reported to be absolute shit. But once you build Frankenstein, it's damn hard to put him down.

It's funny that you mention the tubesites ratio. I mean, it's like they're working for charity and they can only do that for so long. Those guys have Adult Friend Finder and Brazzers banners on their sites which tells me that they're trying to figure out how to make money and not doing it successfully. So maybe you're on to something in that they will eventually kill themselves off but I'm sure someone is always waiting to be the next to try.

It's unlikely that my little site will ever generate anything in revenues but I'm sticking around for many reasons most of which are political in nature. But I'll spare you my political prattle for now....

[ned02]

Well I sure am glad to see the flurry of new posts...
Got lots a spin control to do now dont'cha

The obvious point that you two geniuses fail to understand is that there is more then one opinion out there.
There is more then one approach, to selling, to understanding and to living.

You think you got 'em by the balls? Well good for you guys, you go right ahead and keep on thinking that while you count your declining revenue.

Just the other day I saw a promo from a sponsor offering free full length, tube style clips. Up to 30 minutes a clip for free.

These people are moving in a direction very far removed from your traditional and outdated free-site thing.

They seem to have a different opinion and evidently a wildly different approach to selling porn.

I would be glad to post a link to a sample of what they are offering, just let me know
Don't worry it's not on that big bad boogie man porn-hub, that's been stealing all your sales as of late.

As well you have to distinguish between teaching someone what a free site is (which is nice) and then using the opportunity to fill them with nonsense ideas (which is not nice).

[Kisa]

Originally Posted by ned02

Well I sure am glad to see the flurry of new posts...
Got lots a spin control to do now dont'cha

The obvious point that you two geniuses fail to understand is that there is more then one opinion out there.
There is more then one approach, to selling, to understanding and to living.

You think you got 'em by the balls? Well good for you guys, you go right ahead and keep on thinking that while you count your declining revenue.

Just the other day I saw a promo from a sponsor offering free full length, tube style clips. Up to 30 minutes a clip for free.

These people are moving in a direction very far removed from your traditional and outdated free-site thing.

They seem to have a different opinion and evidently a wildly different approach to selling porn.

I would be glad to post a link to a sample of what they are offering, just let me know
Don't worry it's not on that big bad boogie man porn-hub, that's been stealing all your sales as of late.

As well you have to distinguish between teaching someone what a free site is (which is nice) and then using the opportunity to fill them with nonsense ideas (which is not nice).

yeah, there seems to be a split in the industry as to which direction to go concerning how much content to give away. I would say the cat's out of the bag and so now all you can do is attempt to tame it and work around it, with it, etc....

[Star Man]

Originally Posted by Kisa

It's Kisa not Krista..

Sorry Kisa.I suck with names sometimes.

Originally Posted by ned02

You think you got 'em by the balls?

Yeah..just keep saying that over and over like a mantra you fucking idiot!
got 'em by the balls..got 'em by the balls..got 'em by the balls...

Did this phrase trigger off some chemical imbalance in your head or something ned02? If I would have known you were going to be so deeply effected by it,believe me,I would have used a different choice of words!

Originally Posted by ned02

Just the other day I saw a promo from a sponsor offering free full length, tube style clips. Up to 30 minutes a clip for free.

No!Not That! Anything but 30 minute porn clips!

BTW How are they free full length clips if only the first 30 minutes is free? Use your fucking head!

[ned02]

Originally Posted by Star Man

Sorry Kisa.I suck with names sometimes.


Yeah..just keep saying that over and over like a mantra you fucking idiot!
got 'em by the balls..got 'em by the balls..got 'em by the balls...

Did this phrase trigger off some chemical imbalance in your head or something ned02? If I would have known you were going to be so deeply effected by it,believe me,I would have used a different choice of words!

No!Not That! Anything but 30 minute porn clips!

BTW How are they free full length clips if only the first 30 minutes is free? Use your fucking head!

Why are you so angry?
I guess I said some thing you don't like.
I know the truth can sometimes be hard to deal with.

Anyone in this industry who thinks they have anything by the balls, is probably just holding on to their own scrotum and praying that their income don't drop again.

You can call me as many names as you like, but it does not change the facts.
The adult industry is in a constant state of change and putting on blinders and continuing to repeat what was once successful no longer works.

The coming generation of potential customers are ten times as tech savvy and ten times as connected as the generation before them.
Not only do these people know where the free porn is, many of them built, program and maintain the hundreds of web sites it's on.

Stop kidding yourself and those you pretend to give advice to.
Time to start thinking outside the static, old fashioned free site.

[Useless]

Originally Posted by ned02

Anyone in this industry who thinks they have anything by the balls, is probably just holding on to their own scrotum and praying that their income don't drop again.

I can't help but get let out a little giggle each time I see you stuck on this little point which you like to spin.

Originally Posted by ned02

The adult industry is in a constant state of change and putting on blinders and continuing to repeat what was once successful no longer works.

The coming generation of potential customers are ten times as tech savvy and ten times as connected as the generation before them.
Not only do these people know where the free porn is, many of them built, program and maintain the hundreds of web sites it's on.

Why do you think that the people here don't know that? This isn't big news here, nor any other industry board. I don't know why you feel it necessary to condescend, but I assume it was the way you were treated during your formative years.

Originally Posted by ned02

Stop kidding yourself and those you pretend to give advice to.
Time to start thinking outside the static, old fashioned free site.

You may be surprised to hear that a fair amount of people make their living with free sites. They're not for you, and that's fine, but that doesn't mean that the free site isn't a viable tool. Oh, that's right - anything that you disagree with is nonsense and bullshit.

[Star Man]

Originally Posted by ned02

Why are you so angry?
I guess I said some thing you don't like.
I know the truth can sometimes be hard to deal with.

I'm not angry.Believe it or not I get a kick out of being a prick if someone deserves it.

Originally Posted by ned02

Anyone in this industry who thinks they have anything by the balls, is probably just holding on to their own scrotum and praying that their income don't drop again.

Now your just trying to push my buttons.Nice try.

Originally Posted by ned02

You can call me as many names as you like, but it does not change the facts.

Even though your a pain in the ass,I shouldn't have resorted to name calling and I'm sorry that I called you a fucking idiot.

[Useless]

Originally Posted by ned02

Well I sure am glad to see the flurry of new posts...
Got lots a spin control to do now dont'cha

What spin control? You don't agree with me. So what? You're nothing to me. You disagreeing with me doesn't harm me or my opinions. If people reading this thread agree with you, I don't care. If they agree with me, I still don't care.

Originally Posted by ned02

The obvious point that you two geniuses fail to understand is that there is more then one opinion out there.
There is more then one approach, to selling, to understanding and to living.

No, ned - you're the non-genius who doesn't get that. You can't seem to express your opinion and give advice to Kisa without first attacking our opinions. You're the one who told Star man to "stop talking bullshit" because you disagree with his statements. You could have ignored what he said or respectfully disagreed and continued to dispense your own, but, for whatever childish reason, you had to declare that his opinions were bullshit.

Originally Posted by ned02

You think you got 'em by the balls? Well good for you guys, you go right ahead and keep on thinking that while you count your declining revenue.

You are fucking child. Buy the way, my income has increased over the last 4 months. Weird how someone could possibly make money while not agreeing with the almighty, yet unknown, ned, huh?

Originally Posted by ned02

They seem to have a different opinion and evidently a wildly different approach to selling porn.

Well, as stated, there are many, many ways to sell porn. Was that not obvious or did it just dawn on you?

Originally Posted by ned02

I would be glad to post a link to a sample of what they are offering, just let me know
Don't worry it's not on that big bad boogie man porn-hub, that's been stealing all your sales as of late.

Again, you're a child.

Originally Posted by ned02

As well you have to distinguish between teaching someone what a free site is (which is nice) and then using the opportunity to fill them with nonsense ideas (which is not nice).

Once again, you can't disagree with someone without referring to their opinions as "bullshit" or "nonsense." Of course, they're neither. We're discussing time-tested and proven ways of making sales. Just because it's not the same path that you follow, doesn't mean that it doesn't work. I assume that you simply don't know fuck-all.

[Kisa]

Originally Posted by Useless Warrior

Yes and no. Many, maybe most, studios and license owners are constantly on search-and-kill missions to remove their content from sites infringing on their copyrights. But as along as a few scumbag sponsors, e.g., AdultFriendFinder, Brazzers, etc., continue to support such sites with ad revenue, they aren't going away - and since non-tube webmasters continue to promote sponsors like that, the funding for tube sites is not being choked off.

You make a very good point. As I said without even realizing that you also pointed it out, I noticed those ads on the tube sites and I agree with what you're saying. I already took down all my AdultFF stuff but I do have one or two Brazzer ads but will probably take those down as well. And you're right that my little site doesn't effect much but maybe those are the changes in the 'rules' that need to be made. What if the big sites took a stand against people who promoted and supported those sites... for example, We won't list your site if you have content or banners from x, y, z??? Just a thought...